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Anybody into SHTF related hobbies? I started with prepper stuff the past year and it was quite helpful to be prepared before normgroids started panicking with the coronavirus. I'm reading a lot on the topic and trying to improve in different skills for when SHTF, if ever. Perhaps this doesn't sounds as a very wizardly hobby but I find survivalist stuff interesting and training different skills and improvisation helps me concentrating and not being devoured by my thoughts. I think it's good for wizards

The prepper scene is full of larpers, lunatics, and useless garbage but thankfully there's people who survived through IRL SHTF events and their experiences, giving genuine and useful info for beginners. My recommendation for newbie wizards interested in this area is to read Selco (Bosnian war survivor) and Ferfal (Argentine economic collapse survivor). They're among the most genuine out there and there's lots of common points in their thoughts and advice


I believe in prepping ideologically, and the beer virus just strengthens that. I'm also into outdoors stuff, so it just feeds into my survivalism interests. There's something quite noble to be able to live without society. Still, it's probably a hard life, so the next best thing would self sufficiency. I do kind of compare self sufficiency with prepping though since both would help in a disaster.

What made you interested in this kind of stuff? Are you willing to talk about just prepping and survivalism, or something more broad like bushcraft, self sufficiency, etc.? I think bushcraft would be great for total societal collapse myself.


> What made you interested in this kind of stuff?
Originally, paranoia and fear of genuine SHTF

>Are you willing to talk about just prepping and survivalism, or something more broad like bushcraft, self sufficiency, etc.?

Yes ofc any related stuff is welcomr besides the title


I'm not into prepping, but I'm really interested in being self sufficient. I'm about buying some acres plot, I hope my parent help me with the loan, because otherwise is gonna get impossible.

About prepping, the most important stuff is to buy seeds and some farms animals. Due coronavirus I bought some 25kg bags of different grains (non processed/integral) and legumes and 50l of bleach. The cheapest way is to buy seeds for forage - you only need to wash them if you want them for eating.
I spent less than 400 eur and I could survive easily 3 years without gardening, but if you do plant the seeds you are not gonna have any problem in this life - as long you hide from other humans.
I also brought more seeds of hort stuff. Having hundred-thousands of seeds of each thing you eat is crucial and if well stored lasts for decades.
Other important material, I don't have because realized it was scam before getting serious about corona-chan is ceramic filters for water and books about plants and mushrooms in your area (edibles and medicinal). Of course weapons, knives, and woodworking tools are top priority, but I'm bad at making stuff and get a weapon here is a lot of work.

If you live in a city and shtf the first thing is to run away from there. Hopefully, earth is still somewhat quite low populated in almost all areas.

I'm really interested into brushcrafting, any good source? What techniques are easy and robust to build from bushes?
Where I live there are tons of them and you can harvest for free as much poles as you want - bamboo would be better but. Because my unskills I thought strapping machine could help me with the poles.


>If you live in a city and shtf the first thing is to run away from there
According to OP's sources (Ferfal and Selco) it's not so much the case. Most brutal violence happened into isolated places and small villages in the balkans because there's nowhere to escape and gangs/raiders know there will be resources there. In Ferfal's case when SHTF there's still some sort of "system" for a while, with whatever remains of it concentrating resources, services and whatever law force into the main cities and left the countryside and small towns free for all. He says it's better to be in a middle sized town close to a city in a community of people who knows each other than being in middle of nowhere


I guess it depend on what kind of shit, but if the system collapses you won't find any food in the city - you are at the mercy of red cross and alikes, since money will be useless.
Balkans has been a specially bloody place during history… some cities were controlled by gangs, which is like bully cops but all day high and free to do whatever it crosses their mind.

I wasn't talking about going to small villages, but going to regions with low density and start growing stuff there, if possible in no ones soil. Living in a tent makes it easy to hide and run. If you find a good place you should be able to see people coming much before they can notice you.


a world without internet or modern conveniences isnt worth living. plus im poor. i guess if i was rich i'd be torrenting and archiving literally everything and preparing a bunker for myself


>Most brutal violence happened into isolated places
I live in South Africa and this kinda applies here, it's the case with the white farmers who get killed every once


Well the thing is not about living in a world without internet (that'd be primitivism) but being prepared in case that happens

>i guess if i was rich i'd be torrenting and archiving literally everything

You are right in fact. There's a venezuelan guy with a prepper/bushcraft channel and he recommends downloading some series and stuff to be distracted. He says that the govt there all of a sudden cuts internet off when something big about the government is leaked then there's continuous propaganda being blasted with speakers in the street or in the tv so to avoid becoming insane you unironically must stock some stuff to watch or read in those times


Going back to a world without the internet would be great. The internet made everything measurably worse (politics, journalism, work, communication). The only time it was any good was during the 90's and early 00's when it was a hangout for nerds.


The internet did not do anything, it simply unmasked what was already there.


Why bother?
I already don't want to live, collapse would just give me a better reason to jump off the nearest bridge


By prepping you can die comfy in your shelter while also watchingnormalfags going crazy and massacre each other over a piece of bread


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thats the dream


Do you think the medium has no effect at all?


In this case? No. The things you listed that were affected like politics, journalism, work, and communication were all either equally as bad before or didn't need the internet in the first place.


what resources you find useful about bushcraft?


If I were you, I would highly recommend you research the so called godfather of survivalism, aka Kurt Saxon. Most of his radio shows are on youtube and his books are also online.



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Here is a video clip of Kurt Saxon from a BBC documentary called "The Survivalists"


What would your post apocalyptic wizard lair look like?


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I'm afraid I don't have any books or resources related to bushcraft. I'm interested in it, and believe in it, but haven't done much in relation to it. Sorry.


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Check out Kurt Saxon's works. Most of his radio shows are on Youtube and many of books are available online.

Radio show:




Here is a pdf about places in the US and Canada which are useful to relocate to:


Finally some copies of Backwoods homes magazine with useful homesteading information along with being super comfy:



Do you have any more comfy Egyptian paintings like that?


This. I use the survival rule of 3;
3 minutes ~ need air
3 hours ~ need shelter
3 days ~ need water
3 weeks ~ need food
I plan to live remote enough that I don't need more than one rifle and some ammo.


I get painfully hungry after 16 hours of no food and start getting desperate after 20 hours


I prepped as a hobby for a few years now, but I've been getting more into it again in recent times for obvious reasons. Most of the things I prep for are fairly common problems rather than some more unlikely event like civil war or zombies. I have savings in case of an emergency; I try to stay active and healthy to minimise health problems (doing stuff like hiking and camping is doubly beneficial for survival); I have rainwater barrels in case of drought and to save on water bills; I have a vegetable garden to learn skills and save some money on food bills; I never let my car's fuel go below the half-way mark; I have cash, books, games and a camping stove in case the electricity goes out, etc. I always travel with a small backpack, even if it is just to the shops. Along with my usual work stuff or shopping in the main pocket, it also has in the front pocket a foldable raincoat, cash, book, power bank, tissues, a tiny first aid kit, a tiny LED torch, a pair of socks, a few bars of chocolate and a bottle of water. This is all stuff I've had to use at one time or another, from train delays to forgetting to charge my mobile, to stepping in a puddle. I also have a month worth of food in my house at all times, just various long-life stuff I normally eat (porridge, pasta, soup, chocolate, etc) kept on a stock rotation rather than a supply of survival biscuits wasting space and are just going to be thrown out after a few years. This combined with a small supply of medicines and toiletries meant I weathered the recent shortages and shutdowns with almost no impact. And indeed, all the stuff I mentioned above is also a reaction to problems that have happened in the recent past, such as fuel shortages and credit card payment systems going down, so I am better prepared for the events next time.

I do slightly regret not doing/getting some things earlier. For example I considered getting a supply of stuff like masks and gloves, but thought it was going too far into larper territory. Now those things are 4 times the price they used to be. If money was not a problem I would probably have more fun larping, probably even going as far as installing solar panels and buying a caravan home for bugout purposes. But unfortunately being poor forces me to be sensible in my preps. Oh well.

My main worry is defence, especially as I grow older. I live alone in the country, am alone, and in my declining country (UK) you are limited on what you can do to defend yourself.


>I never let my car's fuel go below the half-way mark;

A bicycle is more useful for me as I live in the town centre. The roads here suck; two cars can cause a traffic jam.


I don't think you will make it.


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I am also very poor (neet) and from the UK, so I've been trying to find ways for surviving for a month for as little as possible. I've slowly been learning and researching the most cost-effective way to survive in this expensive dystopia, especially since the lockdowns and panic buying. Not easy considering how expensive food and everyday items have gotten in the past year alone. I have been assuming the worse and I will be without water, electricity and heating for the month of January (31 days).


Need: 2.5 litres a day for drinking, more for cooking, cleaning and hygiene. I've rounded this up to 10 litres a day.
Have: I bought three 100-liter water butts and have connected them to my drain pipes, still short of the 310 litres I need, but I'm hoping the wet british weather can help me there. I considered filters and stuff to make the water drinkable, but thought chlorine tablets were the most cost-effective at just £5 for 2000 litres. Another £5 for a collapsible container that can hold 10 litres for purification.
Cost: 3x£25 butts, 1x£5 tablets, 1x£5 container = £85


Need: The three main things needed from what I can see are 2500 calories, protein and vitamins. All food needs to last a long time without electricity, so fresh and frozen foods are out.
Have: Best long-term protein I could find was whey protein powder. A 2kg protein bag from a pound store contains more than enough protein, will feel filling and will last over a year. Vitamins and minerals I can get from tablets. The best value I could find was the asda brand. They have a good balance of cost and 24 vitamins and minerals compared to a dozen in the cheaper pound store brands. £3 for a 90-tablet pack, two tablets a day will help keep me healthy. I also get Omega 3 fish oil for healthy fats, £4 for 90, two a day. The calories are simple, pasta and rice provide loads of carbs and last forever, as well as other dry stuff like crackers and dried nuts and fruit. 200g of rice or pasta, a large plate, is just over 700 calories, but if you add a sauce, tinned meat or beans to this, I am confident it will all add up to over 2500 calories a day with my other meals. And if you get stuff like brown rice and pasta, it will help with stuff like fibre too. Soups are good too and can even be ate cold. Soups and cooking sauces come in various flavours so they can help stop your meals from being boring. Tip for anyone who is tired of their sause being too watery, a teaspoon of cornflour makes a difference. Condiments such as salt, pepper and vinegar can also make a world of difference to a meal. Custard or rice pudding can make a nice dessert and morale booster, especially if you add things like chocolate, honey, jam, crushed biscuits, dried fruit or nuts. All that dessert stuff is full of sugar, which is a load of calories and energy. Peanut butter is probably the best for being packed with calories and protein, and can be added to the protein shake or desserts or can just be eaten alone. Various flavourings such as squashes, teas, coffee and instant hot chocolate can help can help disguise any remaining chemical taste from water purification.
Cost: 1x£15 protein, 1x£3 vitamins, 1x£4 omega3, 1x£3 3kg pasta, 1x£6 4kg rice, 31x£0.50 soup, 16x£1 sauce, 1x£1.50 cornflour, 8x1.50 tin meat, 31x£0.50 tin vegetables, 3x£1 condiments, 16x£0.50 custard, 15x£0.50 pudding, 4x£1 chocolate, 8x0.50 biscuits/crackers, 1x£2 honey, 2x£1 jam, 4x£2 fruit/nuts, 2x£2.50 Peanut butter, 5x£1 flavourings = £140


Need: 4 rolls of toilet paper, 2 toothpaste, 2 bars of soap, bleach and washing up liquid
Have: 10 rolls of loo roll, 2 toothpaste, 4 bars of soap, 4 litres of bleach, 1 litre of washing up liquid. I am well stocked just from bulk-buying whatever is on sale
Cost: 1x£3 roll, 2x£1 toothpaste, 1x£1 soap, 2x£1 bleach, 2x£1 dishes = £10


Need: 30 minutes of cooking a day, 6 hours of extra heat a day, 3 hours of extra light a day
Have: Central oil runs on electric, so that's out. I am lucky enough to have a small fireplace in my house. Over the past year, I have been collecting any wood I see, whether it's a broken branch in the park or broken pallets at the dump or building sites. Cardboard is also a good source of fuel, but it burns quickly and chokes the fireplace with ash too quickly. I've actually managed to build a decent collection of wood and it should be enough for a few weeks of heat with a fire lit a few hours a day. From experience I know how badly the damp and cold affects your health, especially your lungs, when you have no heat so it is important to try and keep your room/house warm not just yourself. I'm currently trying the old trick of hanging blankets on my walls to see if that will help insulate from the cold walls and make the room feel less cold. Of course, make sure you wrap up with plenty of layers too. A small gas stove is the only way I can think of to cook food without electricity, I don't think I will be able to cook food properly on the wood fire. I got a small one-ring stove and canisters that last for about an hour each at high heat (to boil water). One trick I have learnt is to soak the rice and pasta in cold water for a day beforehand, this will save about half the cooking time as all you need to do is heat to boiling for a few minutes. This will allow me the luxury of about 15 minutes extra gas per day for making coffee or warm water to clean myself. The hot water from the cooking is also a precious source of heat, so I can save it by pouring it into a hot water bottle, warms my bed nicely before I go to bed. Lighting is simple enough, I have three solar-powered LED lights, one for my main room, one for the hall and another for the bathroom. They all have a panel at a window, so they are always charging during the day. However, I have found candles to be useful too, not just for lighting, but heat as well. A single tealight can warm your body up very well, will cast enough light to read from and will last about 4 hours. I tend to find the tealights to be better value than the pillar candles as the big candle can wastefully hollow out while the tealights generally burn all their wax. Asda currently have the best value at 100 for £2.
Cost: 1x£1 matches, 1x£2 fire starters, 6x£10 blankets, 1x£20 stove, 2x£8 16 canisters, 1x£5 hot bottle, 3x£15 solar lgihts, 1x£2 candles = £151

>Work and Entertainment

Need: something to do with no electricity, electric cuts about twice a year where I live and it is unbelievable how much I rely on modern media to keep me entertained.
Have: A bookshelf full of books, games and hobbies. The bargain book shops are great for filling up with entertainment. Penguin classics are usually cheap books, as are other old book collections such as Sherlock Holmes. I got a dozen jigsaw and puzzle games too, from a rubix cube to a book of sudoku. I have a few model kits, ranging from planes to buildings, I've already built a couple and enjoyed it, so I got a few more. I only got a few board games as I would be mostly by myself, but I did get a few packs of playing cards, and a book teaching me how to play dozens of card games as well as another book teaching me how to do card tricks. I got a 4 in 1 mini games table, which has football, hockey, pool and table tennis all in one. I got a dart board too, so I am well on my way to starting up my own pub. I have a couple of outdoor things too, I have a basketball hoop and a couple of tennis rackets to keep me moving in my small back yard. This is all stuff I think I will be doing in the evening as I will be busy during the day with survival, either planting and weeding my tiny garden to produce fresh food, fishing in a nearby river, etc. I tried a windup radio for music, but that was rubbish. Not the radio, but the music that's being played nowadays. I got a solar panel for charging my phone and tablet, but that didn't seem to do much on overcast days so I doubt it will be much use.
Cost: 30x£10 stories/comedies, 6x£20 DIY/garden books, 10x£10 history/crime/fact books, 6x£15 jigsaws, 6x£15 puzzle games, 4x£5 puzzle books, 2x£10 games books, 4x£20 board games, 2x£1 playing cards, 1x£60 games table, 1x£25 darts, 6x£30 model kits, 1x£10 tin whistle, 2x£10 music book, 1x£15 hoop, 1x£5 basketball, 2x£10 rackets, 1x£5 tennis balls, 12x£15 garden tools, 1x£20 fishing equipment, 1x£15 radio, 1x£30 solar panel = £1407

£1,793 in total spent so far. As you can see, the entertainment and work tools are by far the most expensive thing, but luckily they were all one-time buys slowly bought over years or got as gifts. Most of the other things are one-time buys as well, so I should keep costs low after this. Food should hopefully be my biggest expense after this, which I will be buying anyway, but could be helped by me growing my own things next spring.

Any tips or advice is always appreciated.


I don't know what to add but I'll thank you for the detailed post and sharing it with us. I never thought about entertainent without electricity or internet so that's a good think to consider. Thanks


Do you live in a house or apartment? I live in an apartment and started small gardening in the balcony with plastic containers and cardboard boxes. I've grow succesfully potatoes, azuki beans and carrots. Look up urban gardening projects in youtube


I assume most of those costs are one off as £1400 so far sounds very expensive. But taking out the entertainment things then the budget looks good as your buys will last for ages.
One thing you probably already know but didn't mention so I'll say it: coffee shops/fast food places and the like are a gold mine for sachets of condiments and sugar/salt. Not from the counters but from empty tables. People grab them but don't use them. I never go to coffee shops as I hate them but I have walked through them using going to the bathroom as a pretense, and then I grab all the sachets on the way. Good luck with your plan and I hope January isn't all ice and snow.


I forgot to mention I got dumbbells too (£60) and the bookshelf I made myself for about £20. Very important to keep fit and healthy during shtf.

Entertainment is important, especially in the long winter nights. It's very expensive, but if you don't think it's likely that the electric will cut for more than a few hours, then you will save a lot with all the free and "free" stuff you can do on your computer, e.g., you don't need to buy a chess board, you have chess on your computer, you don't need to buy classic books, you can download them from Project Gutenberg, etc.

An alternative is setting up solar generation so you can run your devices for a few hours each day. I'm currently looking into this, but haven't really a clue where to start. Does anyone have any good links where a retard (me) can learn about solar or even wind generation? I'm not looking to build a solar farm that can run kettles and fridges, I obviously can't afford that, I just think having a powered phone can make a lot of difference in survival.

I live in a semi-detached bungalow, with a driveway at the front and small garden at the back. I doubt I will be able to get more than a few metres of vegetables, I did get window boxes though, so I can grow strawberries or radishes in them as well.

Yes, most are one-off, my aim is to keep things I have to repeatedly buy to a minimum, which is why I'm trying to avoid things like batteries. I used to grab packets of condiments, but many places where I live have gotten wise to this and now just have common bottles. That's if the cafes are even open…


How many acres are you thinking of buying?

Also, how will you be able to live for 3 years without gardening?


>my soldiers
Wizchan 2021


Is this 80% food prepping? Log cabin near a river and tons of preserved food.


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Yes. As a neet I've recently spent all of my income, christmas and b-day income (32 here), on my go-bag. I just need to get thin enough to take off and then I won't worry so much. In the past I had no money to spend on it but my parents recently in the past three years upped the amount they give me to 400 usd per year when it used to be basically 0. Not to blog further about that, the point is that picture related is basically what I have and decided to have it as I can't stand the idea of having literally nothing if I had to live in the woods and also because I realized my very retarded father (the only one who has money) was never going to even buy so much as a battery nor let people have water bottles stocked up during literal hurricanes. I had to sit in the dark heat for an entire week before with nothing to do, not even a way to charge a small 5v device. It was ridiculous. Never again. And he nearly died form it on top of it but he's too retarded to break away from his tight assed habits of never spending money on a whim. Right as the danger closes in he thinks with only buyer's remorse. "What if it doesn't hit us?" The son of a literal bitch makes only 1.2k per month and while supporting the mother and I actually saved up probably 25k in the past three years. That's how much of a kike he is, except stupid.

Anyway, here be the image. It includes many things such as a shower bag and more than one solar panel device. I also have a shot of the stuff inside but that's harder to make out what the stuff actually is.

If not for the hypertension meds I'm on and sporadic plantar fasciitis (and lack of transport out of my shithole) I'd have already spent gobs of time in the woods. The last time I was in a forest I had nothing at all with me and spent the night in the forest during winter (mild due to the location) so it's not like I don't have the balls to do it. I live nowhere near an actual forest currently and even sleeping outside or in a car is 3 days in jail here. Also going into a park is illegal at night in general. Honestly it's a gestapo shithole (the police get the vast majority of the tax money going into them and the sheriff is literally insane too but uses his power to defame any competitor) in general.

>this is too blog tier but…

But yes…. the image shows what's there. If the electricity goes away and I still have a river to get water from the filter for instance claims to be good for about 100k gal of water, not that I trust it to work that long. I could also boil water and make fire using the ferro rods I have or e-lighter even that is of course chargeable through he usb as most of my things are that are electronic. It'd take too long to go over everything in the image though I have three 5v devices all of which can be charged by the various solar devices I own and two of which are in the bag and a third would go into a jacket pocket. They all three have 800 books on them and many retro games too. I'd not be too bored but it'd take a minimum of 3 months to grow beans and such to harvest. That is the real problem, assuming that they'd even sprout. My ideal botany plan won't even be able to be met quickly as more than one item is of a different climate and also some are trees that'd take five+ years to grow. My ideal botany plan/list though is this:

1) lentil
2) potato
3) onion (green)
4) lemon(grass (that way it's not a tree)) (for lemonade (or for soups))
5) dill weed (for lentil/mushroom/potato soups)
6) paprika (for lentil/mushroom/potato soups)
7) black pepper (for lentil/mushroom/potato soups)
8) garlic (for lentil/mushroom/potato soups)
9) kale (calcium)
10) seaweed (kelp (for iodine))
11) olive (sodium)
12) stevia (sweet, for lemonade)
13)granny smith apple (or raspberry (I like tart and berries from a bush grow faster than a tree))
14) peanut/almond/cashew (for a change and for it's oil perhaps if the olive would take too long to grow, and it would, and almonds have calc and cashew is the best tasting but peanuts might be the easiest to grow but all three take forever to cook….) or maybe just acorns and wash the tannic acids out
15) avocado (a tree but is fatening and healthy, lowers cholesterol and goes okayish in my lentil/mushroom/potato soups
16) hawthorn (to replace ace inhibitor) (a bush version exists that I own the seeds of)
17) bell pepper
18) white mushroom (b12 potentially due to a bacterium that attacks the shroom's edges, and goes well in the soup)
19) soapwort/soap plant (for mild soap rather than making real soap from fats and lye water)

Of all of that I'd have to grow them all, growing the white mushrooms in a fish tank or something of which would stick out. You'd need many tanks too as you have to eat way too much to get any good amount of b12.

Anyway, that stuff up there is mixed climate and mixed in general and would probably not work out well at all. Also it's not even the plants I'm all interested in, that is the modest list. The real list is over 50 plants rather than just under 20, but that would be lunatic mode positivity to think I'd have some 'garden of Eden' to live in.

I have a secondary go-bag with mostly lentils and rice in it and old ramen packets for spices and sodium. Also nutritional yeast as cheese would be too cumbersome to carry though I wish I had just lentils, potatoes, many spices, and cheeses, though too much that'd be. I'd like to acquire the seeds for all listed plants, mushroom notwithstanding, but they cost more than you'd expect when you have such a budget as I. Some I can just have from my snap route, such as the lentil as it is a seed, but potato seeds they don't sell though you can just put them in the ground that'd be hard to carry, lemon they sell though that is a tree, dill weed they sell, peppers they do, garlic is a bit big to carry too, kale they do not, seaweed obviously is from the ocean so that's just me being silly, olives are a tree and always pickled, stevia is a big nope, granny smith is there but a tree, raspberries are a thing to think about as possible, peanuts are a good option, avocado is a tree, hawthorn I do have, and that's the list really. Hit or miss as to whether or not I'd have to buy the thing. Even if you can just replant it I'd rather not as I'll have to transfer it all across the nation when I go, so just putting the potato in the ground is a bad idea. I would only want to have to carry what I had to as it'll be damaged and or just too cumbersome.

I really need an income before I can do it and I'm a 30+ that has never had a job before and pretty much nothing seems like it will work out, such as buying and reselling, as dystopian as that is I don't have assets enough to start such a thing. Even donation of plasma I failed at as they kept rejecting me over tachycardia even when my blood pressure is NOT high. Like yin and yang.


>>59231 (me)
Also I have the soapwort seeds already too that I bought. If it takes too long to get out there they won't even germinate though. It's so depressing.


Just seems impossible in Europe if you're not 1% already and if that's the case why are you still in Europe preparing for SHTF?


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here are some useful tips from a guy who was in a shtf scenario


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Most folks can't hold their breath for 3 minutes either. The rules are more about survival than comfort. You can live about three weeks without eating anything before you die with a reasonable level of certainty.

Most folks can go 3 days before they become willing to do things they ordinarily wouldn't for food.


if shit hit the fan would it be best to loot and kill straight away before the others get to the point they are forced to?


Anyone planning that kind of response isn't going to survive long. If you're in the looting killing mob you missed the boat on getting out of the bad areas and having stocks of things quietly set aside to try and survive.

There is nothing to be gained from killing anyone, and once you're at the point of needing to loot things are truly desperate.


No, someone with a gun would just shoot you or other raiders would kill you.

It is almost always better to avoid dangerous situations not intentionally run head first into them or go out of your way to create them.

It is like asking if the best way to survive a fire is to light a building on fire then run into it to go out the other side.


this makes sense thanks
I meant more before people started to panic at all


So you are saying you would want to just rob people or do robberies in stores as a normal criminal?

If it was "before people started to panic" the cops would get involved and you would eventually end up in jail or dead when they get ahold of you for all the crimes.
Doesn't seem like a good survival plan.
See the analogy about setting a building on fire then running into it because you want to escape out the back door.

You would be creating a situation that actively negatively effects your odds of survival while hurting others and yourself for no good reason.
It is to put simply really fucking stupid.
Not even stupid ha ha. But stupid as in what the fuck is wrong with your brain stupid.


I was thinking more along the lines of lets say the city just got into a position where SHTF but people have not yet descended into violence.


>I was thinking
No you weren't.


I like this example: imagine if guns were never invented. Sure people would still be violent, but limiting their ability to express that violence so drastically is clearly significant. Plus often the reactions to that newly increased potential creates a feedback loop. You need a gun because they have a gun. You need your propaganda because they have theirs. The internet definitely made things worse.


The world was significantly more violent before guns were a common thing. Guns aren't actually a limiting factor in the expression of violence. Just look at all the mass stabbings in china or around the world with similar numbers of casualties to mass shootings in the US. Or that the worse mass killings don't involve firearms at all.
All the wars. All the suffering.
The tool used isn't what actually matters. You need to get to the first principles. The root of the issues, rather then being focused on the dust that settles on the leaves.

While all tools can have negative effects when in the hands of those that are ignorant in how to properly use it, that doesn't mean the tool is bad or that the tool has actually made things worse overall from a wider perspective. It is only when you focus on the microcosme of a few stand out negative events. To focus on the dust on the leaves. That you lose perspective and blame the tool while totally missing the root of the problem.
Take a step back and take in the whole, then go backward until you reach the first principles. To look at the whole plant then trace things from the dust on the leaves to the leaves, to the stem, and all the way down to the root.


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I've decided it's time to take action and maximize my chances of survival for when some sort of collapse, war, whatever happens.
I want to have a safehouse, somewhere to go to as last resort, and in the meantime I want it to be my hobby to prep it to best of my abilities.
Which areas in Europe offer the best chance of survival in case of a collapse and reign of survival? Where can I find fresh water realiably, where can I fish and grow my own food reliably, where can I hide reliably? Doesn't have to be conveniant, might not have a road good enough to park under my own doorstep. Being able to procure firearms legally before the collapse would be a bonus, but we can't have everything.

I've been thinking about Croatia.


Glad this is in the hobby section as that's really what most "prepping" is. It's fantasizing as some kind of badass warrior in a post-apocalyptic world and consuming thousands of dollars worth of gear to LARP with. It's basically airsoft but with real guns that never get used. However there are some who are genuinely preparing for a collapse in the economy/society. But doing that is much harder than merely buying a bunch of shit.

I think we are guaranteed to see a total collapse within the century if not much sooner. Every sign is pointing to it. The modern industrial civilization is so complex and full of vulnerabilities there's no way it won't implode due to some unforeseen event. The pandemic of late wasn't even that bad, it paled in comparison to the Spanish Flu, yet look at all the instability it caused. A true collapse would be the most ungodly hell that has ever been unleashed on the earth. I sometimes wonder if the people spending all their money on escapism rather than prepping are the wise ones, as the post-collapse world won't be worth living in even if one does survive it.

And frankly as wizards, we are the worst off as being part of a close-knit community is essential. No matter how much you buy, as soon as something runs out or breaks you'll be forced to venture out all by yourself. The only way we'd have a chance is if we started a wiz village built with the main intention of surviving the collapse. But it would probably be doomed to failure as I imagine a bunch of neurotic, depressed, unskilled men would not cooperate well.


I think Europe will actually be better off than NA. Europe having so few guns that require strict licensing to get is actually an advantage. It means you won't have to be afraid of getting shot by any person you come across, so there will be a lot more cooperation. It's likely the police/military of the area will take over which may maintain order. If someone does have a gun they'll either get disarmed by the local authority, they'll use it to maintain an authority of their own, or they'll just use it to hunt. So if you manage to get a gun you will have a very unique advantage. If you don't you'll at worst have to listen to the one guy who does have a gun. Would still be better than living in a never-ending warzone.


is there any good books that teach actual useful survival information with instructions? All the books ive ever seen advertised are just pamphlets that tell you your basic survival needs without elaborating or are just schitzo posts with nothing valuable. If so could someone post them?


I get the feeling you haven't actually read any books on the subject and are just projecting you ignorance in a effort to get people to google shit you won't read for you.

Why this thread brings out the trolls is beyond me.


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What I used.

along with a old out of print book on etable plant identification I got at a thrift store that I am not going to bother digging out and posting.

Though there are thousands of other books that are good. To the point that I seriously doubt you researched anything at all.


For myself currently i am starting to grow fruit/ vegetables and bought a book on foraging in my country that is my starting block


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this will be a solar/battery powered raspberry pi with [internet in a box] headless raspbian that you can connect to as a hotspot and browse offline wikipedia, openstreetmaps, and other useful things like that. can also plop in usb sticks full of content/resoures, like books or images and video. i have some extra 256gb sticks that i will load up with pdfs and information

raspberry pi 3a uses only like 1-4w depending on the load. it will have a 12v 20a sealed lead acid battery, a 20w solar panel, and a cheap mmpt charge controller which should let it operate 24h with no sunlight at max load. im going to try using the usb output directly from the charge controller. so the pi will be powered with a simple usb-micro usb cable

it will be mounted on my back porch, the panel hanging out to get sun, and the pi and battery in some vented enclosure i haven't figured out yet. it should just work and doesn't need to be physically interected with you can manage it entirely through your browser once you connect to the hotspot

raspberry pi boards are outrageously pricey atm. even used boards, that sold for $30 3 years ago, not sell for like $100-150. i got the pi 3a for $50 which is still kind of silly since it was orginally $25, but at least this one is new and uses less power than the pi 4. the battery was only $30 on ebay which is nice, anything under $2/amp for 12v sealed lead acid is ok, and this was $1.5/a. still deciding on the mppt charge controller, they are almost all chinese stuff so it's hard to tell what is good. they all seem serviceable as long as you have the correct volt/current coming from your solar panels. most of the reviews i see for problems with cheap mppt, and they admit this, is that their solar panels voltage output is too high for their battery. i still don't know all that much about electricity, but the controllers have the maximum voltages and current listed on them and it differs based on the battery voltage, and those guys clearly didn't give a shit and just hooked it up anyway


cool project wizzie. i enjoyed your post and think tech projects like this develop extremely useful skills. good post.


What is the advantage of this over simply saving all that content on a hard drive? I get the whole solar thing, but what is the point of the raspberry pi?


hard drive is for storing information, pi with IIAB is for broadcasting information (and other things) via hotspot so any device can access it. you could NAS some hard drives but the power for simply spinning a single hard drive is more than running a pi. with a pi you have very low power requirements, so you dont need a big battery or solar panel to keep it running 24/7. the idea behind this is a humanitarian project called solarSPELL.

it's basically a plastic tupperware with all this inside it
-solar panel
-raspberry pi
-voltage regulator
-portable usb charger

they make these things in bulk and ship to africa and other poor places so for example you just throw it outside in the sun and suddenly your classroom has a virtual learning environment (IIAB includes learning and educational stuff like khan academy for example). it is extremely cheap. but the battery system they are using doesn't provide 24/7 power


Just got into gardening and shooting guns since the beginning of this year. It's made me think why the hell isn't everyone taught these kind of life skills growing up? Just like how everyone should know how to take care of their own car. More useful than 90% of the shit you learn in high school.


Yeah I agree, I think your chances of survival in an urban area when true SHTF is nil. Your best chance of survival is in a rural area with as you said, a closely-knit community.

I've got a shitload of food, ammo, water barrels, ham radio, "kool gear" etc. stocked up, but I know it's all completely useless as long as I'm still living in an urban area. Though I'm planning to get the hell out of here in 4-6 months.

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