It's because is moe, there is not much you can do.
>It's ok to be invested in idols and jpop in general, even though it's as trashy and as much of a corporate product as pop in the west.
This is what always bothered me the most and I understand what OP is talking about. Idols are nothing more but boy-bands for grown men. Maybe it's my good luck on not having come across them, but I have yet to meet some shameless idol shit eater who tries to make it seem more than some plastic marketed emotional prostitution.
I used to have the same feelings for vocaloid and teenagers talking about how it's better than US trash pop even though it's just J-pop, but it's at least just a tool that anyone can and does use, and the characters are just blank-slates that anyone can have fun with, so the blame lies on their taste.
Also, following every seasonal anime isn't different from watching every new Hollywood film. Not to shit on hobbies(unless you're one of those idol otaku then fuck you), but there are people out there who think Japanese media is superior to stupid shit like "They have no Jews" "They're blah blah conservative honorary aryan" even though they're just as shallow pandering consumerist as the US media.
And that just annoys me
you don't understand asian culture and you're looking at the idol phenomenon with western eyes
satoshi kon's perfect blue is a good movie about that argument. btw i think that the south korean kpop scene is becoming evne more toxic than the jap's
>>149246>and you're looking at the idol phenomenon with western eyes
I can't imagine seeing it positively with any sort of lenses. Everything about it is disgusting.
Also, this thread is about seeing western reactions to Japanese products, isn't it? So I don't see it as thread-inappropriate, though I think I need to hear what you mean.
What about Asian culture do I need to understand? And how will understanding this change my view?>btw i think that the south korean kpop scene is becoming evne more toxic than the jap's
What I feel applies to all of those idol groups, in fact I see more talk about the K-pop ones than the J lately. It also seems much more blatantly sexual, while the Japanese are obsess over purity. But I also may be talking out of the ass.
God I just wanna murder idol otaku. Trash. Repopulate the world with train otaku only.
I used to have a DVD of Ghost in the Shell ages ago, and it came with DVD full of anime trailers, one of them being Perfect Blue. The thing has been on my backlog for a decade now
What you're saying is going to go in one ear and out the other.
Your average chan user is the typical socially awkward 20 something who wants to be normal. Anime/Japanese media is practically a drug to them because of how it's tailor made for you to self insert in stuff like a high school where beautiful high school succubi love you for being what a real life society would see as a socially awkward loser. It's astounding how the trifecta of japanese media (anime/manga/games/) heavily relies on sex to sell their stuff. People will complain about a west game having a succubus main character beating up a ton of men but no one has a problem with a japanese game having a succubi main character who might as well be wearing dental floss beating up legions of men left and right. It's both the same shit.
Give some examples, vague whining like this has the potential to be the next /ck/ thread. I expect a laugh
Do you want me to sit around shitty imageboards to compile a bunch of screenshots only for you to say I cherrypicked? I made this thread based off my experience observing this. >>149244
perfectly puts into picture the crowd I'm talking about.
Just names are fine anon
The /ck/ poster made it so you can just go on 4chan and see how much he warped reality. Do you have the ability to go the very moments that gave OP this idea?
Also, you could apply the /ck/ poster incident with pretty much every other thread here. We all have different experiences from each other, and have no real idea how warped each other's perceptions may be from the actual truth of the events they describe. There maybe several posters that agree with an OP, even though you may not. You can post this about every other thread.
But you chose this one.
Well you obviously didn't see me asking for examples on other topics on old threads
This is not exclusive to Japanese media, language/cultural barriers often result in decreased standards.
Because those ones didn't hit a string with you
Makes sense. When you're younger (new to consuming media) every story seems great. As you get older you start to see the cracks in it until you can tell good from bad. If you start consuming media from another culture I guess it's a similar thing. You see tropes and stories that aren't common to what you'd experience in your own and you won't really know what's good until you've spent a decent time with it.
You misread me, I mean I did ask on those threads.
Ah, I apologize then
why do gaijin revere japan like a sacred cow?
Calling someone who lives in the west a westaboo makes as much sense as calling a black person a wigger.
When the west starts making things akin to Yotsubato for example then you can call me. For now it is a fact the japanese are producing some unique media that isn't found anywhere else, regardless of it being copies of each other or not.
> the west starts making things akin to Yotsubato
They've been doing that for a long time. They're called sitcoms. Shows about the daily lives of Norman's family and friends as they learn life lessons and have heartfelt moments with one another.
>the japanese are producing some unique media
Cartoons made to sell sex and escapism to incels, cartoons made to push politics. They're both shit.
you know nothing about anime, i pity your abysmal ignorance
You're right. The sea of shows about sexualized succubi being cute every season don't exist at all.
>>149276>sitcoms are on the level of yotsuba
please don't shitpost
It happens on /v/ all the time for videogames and it's really annoying. The idol double standard is the most common thing I can think of that I see outside of /v/. It's funny because I think it happens slightly less here than it does on 4chan.
Well he can probably find some posts from all those garbage 4chan boards he goes to if he really hunts for it. Because of course this is the "everywhere" OP is talking about here; Japanese Culture boards at 4chan. But it's not like he actually needs solid examples is it? It's just some vaguest strawman so he can whine about nonsense. Had one kid on an IB posted this opinion it would be enough for OP, I'm sure. I mean this guy >>149295
goes to an ocean of shit and then gets annoyed "it's so shitty".
Isn't this a terrible combination? people who "can't fucking stand" the most piddling issues and at the same time calls 4chan, reddit and those celeb youtube channels they watch "EVERYWHERE". Must really take a toll on your sanity.
Why are you in this thread complaining and attacking people if it doesn't apply towards you? It's not a strawman because there isn't an argument in the first place and he wasn't attacking anybody in specific. It's a thread where OP mentioned something that annoyed him and people like myself and the many others you see can either say "I haven't noticed" or "yeah I know what you're talking about OP it's really annoying"
Because op struck a chord with who he said was annoying him.
Well I was here responding to >>149243
of course, that's why I quoted the guy in the first place. The argument is; "Japanese media gets a free pass everywhere, West media doesn't". Now I just humored myself and others on tracing this "everywhere" OP talked about. I mean I know whining about shit like this is part of the theatrical act on being on the internet these days so at times I feel like writing a review on the play (that is I posted).
I was actually going to post about OP saying Japanese books getting free pass and Western books doesn't because I'm sure in OP's everywhere land people never read a book in their lives from neither side of the pond. But before I realized I had a full paragraph already and had to ditch the idea. Besides you know how every time you bring something like this up there's the guy ready to say "BOOKS ARE NO BETTER THAN ANY OTHER TYPE OF MEDIA!" and this particular clown event I would pass itt. Can't mix all in one bag you know.
Where else would he be referring to than on youtube, reddit, and imageboards? Those are the main places people go to discuss things, in most of our cases probably primarily imageboards, so obviously it would be the bulk of the "everywhere" in this kind of situation.
>>149305>Well he can probably find some posts from all those garbage 4chan boards he goes to if he really hunts for it
And then you'd say I'm just cherrypicking. I've been through this multiple times in the past and it always ends that way.
>Because of course this is the "everywhere" OP is talking about here
Yes, hyperbole is a thing. You sound like the normans who get upset when they see a post from a wizard saying every succubus is a slut. Are all of them sluts? Obviously I'm not an omnipotent being to determine that. I'm just basing it off of what I've seen from them in the several years in my life. And I'm basing this off of what I've seen browsing various places over time.
>people who "can't fucking stand" the most piddling issues
There's things I can't stand about wizchan, but I still like to browse it. Honestly sounds as if I've struck a nerve here.
>>149304> I be like projecting this hard
OP is not god you know, for one he could have taken people who enjoyed ironically literally mistakenly or deliberately for dramatic effect, this shit is popular in the wizboo crowd, just look at the internet is ending threads
Not the entirety of those places but we're not seriously discussing this are we? Because>>149308
We're in agreement. You won't proof your point ever because I'm sure the same amount of posts you can find of people praising shit Jap media over shit West media someone can find of people praising shit West media over shit Jap media. I'm sure you understand the internet is a big enough place for this to happen right? And that's why you'll not have a discussion over this, because it's endless. So I say again, we agree; you'll not post your proof because it's pointless and I wouldn't say it's cherrypicking because it's also pointless. You wanted to whine about something while being a super buffoon about it and I felt like making fun of your act. I think we're pretty much going like it's suppose to isn't?
>You sound like the normans
OH BOY here we go, act 2. Calling Norman. Human Sacrifice, dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria. A wizchan all time favorite.
>>149310>You won't proof your point ever because I'm sure the same amount of posts you can find of people praising shit Jap media over shit West media someone can find of people praising shit West media over shit Jap media
Like I said before, as you blatantly ignored, I'm sure if I were to bother with sitting around gathering screenshots of people saying that you'd then claim I'm cherrypicking. It happened before and I won't fall into the trap now.
> I wouldn't say it's cherrypicking because it's also pointless
> I'm sure you understand the internet is a big enough place for this to happen right?
I just said it was my experience based on the places I go to. The only one making this out to be big is you, my good sir.
No you idiot, did you miss the big example I gave you? I wasn't calling you a norman. I was saying you were using a similar line of reasoning that they use against us to "prove" wizards are stupid. Again:
>when they see a post from a wizard saying every succubus is a slut. Are all of them sluts? Obviously I'm not an omnipotent being to determine that. I'm just basing it off of what I've seen from them in the several years in my life. And I'm basing this off of what I've seen browsing various places over time.
Is this calling you a norman? The only buffoon here is you, my friend.
English isn't your first language, is it?
It is the moeshit loving weebs you see online. I would assume in Japan a lot of well adjusted adults do not give a shit about anime. An adult who is into anime over there is probably like an adult who is into comic books and cartoons over here.
I could never understand how people loved anime so much, but to each his own.
Dumb thread deserving of dumb replies. Refrain from further posting, thanks.
>>149312>The only one making this out to be big is you, my good sir.
Yes and I don't see you thanking me for it. >I wasn't calling you a norman.
I didn't say you were.>The only buffoon here is you
You can't possibly step in front of a mirror right now with a straight face and say "Man! I can't fucking stand those fucking kids everywhere liking this shit over some other shit! CAN'T FUCKING STAND IT!"
Are you kidding me OP?>>149313
Parents are native English speakers but I don't live in an English speaking country. Is it my first or not? If you're saying this because of my wacky wording I'm doing on purpose.
>>149316>Yes and I don't see you thanking me for it.
>I didn't say you were.>OH BOY here we go, act 2. Calling Norman. Human Sacrifice, dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria. A wizchan all time favorite.
>You can't possibly step in front of a mirror right now with a straight face and say
I don't care what they like, I was saying it's annoying when it's impossible to talk about things because they come in and assert how inferior it is compared to superior nippon media.
>>149317>I was saying it's annoying when it's impossible to talk about things because they come in and assert how inferior it is compared to superior nippon media.
All right OP, let's close on this note. The internet is mostly a garbage heap and I agree with you.
Both of those images embody trash. The cunt from Persona 5, a mediocre JRPG that only has aesthetic, and that cunt from WD2, another mediocre third person open world title with a hacker gimmick. The image is supposed to swoon you over to the left because she looks more appealing, even though the two are going for different art styles depicting different things. And at the end of the day they're both unremarkable games. Both are pandering by different means.
Have you even played watch dogs 2? That succubus in that image was made to be hated.
I agree with most of what you've said but vocaloid music became really creative for what started as shitty sounding plastic voice software. I'm sure someone who listens to more of it then me could post something good but vocaloid producers have done crazy stuff in all sorts of genres so you can't just call all of it shitty j-pop.
It's similar to back in the day when people would call visual kei shitty japanese emo music. Irrational hate biases.
Probably because most of the songs that came from it were shitty jpop
Most songs coming from anywhere is shitty pop.
Neither Japan or the west have made a good commercial video game since the mid 2000s. This is such a pointless argument.
Anime and hollywood have the exact opposite problems. Anime panders to an extremely narrow audience while hollywood panders to as many different demographics as possible. They suck in different ways but there's still good stuff in both.
And lastly, both Japan and the west make some good music outside of the derivative garbage they both produce.
It sounds creepy and weird.
Yeah, I think I haven't said enough because that's partly my point of why I stopped grouping with the rest. I can't really dislike vocaloid, but haven't heard much of it in a long while.
But I mainly had some 2010 teenagers in mind, but you are correct
Japan is a miserable place with an irrevocably fucked up and damaged national psyche. The Japanese may have recovered economically after WW2 but psychologically, it ruined them.
Fuck Japan, most overrated country and culture on the planet
>>149356>Neither Japan or the west have made a good commercial video game since the mid 2000s
This is such a stupid thing to say. For any medium.
Here is vocaloid I think is really creative, probably not for everyone though.
Anyway, I get what you're saying OP, as someone who likes /jp/ stuff the double standards get on my nerves too. You get people like this on both sides of the field, and in pretty much any area. There's nothing wrong with liking something with faults or not liking something for them, but people will take things personally and that's where the real problem lies imo.
This post exemplifies the weird anti-conformist rhetoric that seems to pervade western chan culture and is the most ironic statement I've seen regarding whos national, or rather an ambiguous multi-national hellhole, psyche has been irrevocably fucked up.
Wizkids really get under my skin when they start speaking arrogantly about things you don't understand.
Anime can't be cartoons they are to realistic, they are the idealized form of the human condition. Perfect actors in a perfect world.
>>149478>They are too realistic
They're not even close to realistic.
Are these posts just trolls or are there really people out there who can't grasp the objective reality that anime is merely a style of cartoon that comes from Japan?
Can't tell any more.
They're not trolls, these are posts from stupid people that have found a reason to hate anime and love delude themselves, it must feel great to live feeling like you're being critical about something, when you're clearly not.
If you deny most of anime isn't based around making sexually appealing stinkubbi for failed norcs to oogle at, you're deluded.
I dont care about succubi being sexualized and idolized in Anime, what makes me rage is legit weeaboos like you that cannot understand some people just dont like Anime, I cannot stand it, it's annoying to me, Their voices are annoying, their looks to realistic, they take themselves very seriously, I just don't like it, just how I don't like the color brown, soccer or pineapple juice.
cartoons are shit, so are you saying Anime is shit?
What you're stating is out of discussion and have no relation to my reply, except the fact that you're a faggot that hates without reason.
>>149540>they take themselves very seriously
This is actually an integral part to achieve perfect escapism and why cartoons rarely come close.
I can understand not liking the voices or styles often used. But what I don't understand is how you can dislike something like the color brown, or the entirety of a medium to an extent you'd get mad at it. Or maybe I misunderstood and you only get mad at the people questioning your general dislike in which case it's fine but then I wouldn't expect to see you in this thread since it's for real hate for it.
You dislike the common tropes and narrative devices used in the medium. Which leads you you disliking most of the medium as a whole.
There is no such thing I believe. That only exists within genres.
Some genres are more prevalent than others.
Wizards have an irrational hate for cartoons and I don't question it, In the end you like what you like, and you hate what you hate, there is no logical reasoning, is just what it is.
It's all shit once it's over.
i think it's just becouse it's a rather alien culture, so it seems less rotten. if i were japanese i'd be sick of this shit even more. the only japanese media that i'm sure is legit superior is 80-90s action games and even then there is plenty of trash.
of course he didn't play the game, he's from /v/
remember the shit flinging over trans character in new baldur's gate expansion? it was just one fucking line of dialogue that you get by asking some minor character about his name. while japanese games had trans characters for a while, like bridget, but somehow it doesn't count.
Nier/Drakengard is praised to the ends of the Earth and there's characters who are revealed as being gay or hermaphrodites just for shock value.
Senran thread, anyone who questions why it's ok to like a bland game with only sex pandering going for it is told to go back to neogaf.
The difference is the politics surrounding it usually. You don't see anyone in japan saying how empowering it is to have LGBTQ+ characters or "in your face you bigot" attitude from the media and the people who produce those things.
Except it's actually a pretty good beat'em'up and there's some good writing between all the boob and panty jokes. If you're unable to see past "OMG THIS GAME HAS BOOBIEZ SO IT HAS TO BE BAD!!1" then yeah, you should fuck off back to neogaf, they are 100% right about that.
>>149751>pretty good beat'em up
It's as shallow as hell. You press square, get into the air, and press square some more. There's hardly anything you could even consider a branching combo. You the attack button and you get a launcher. The only variation you'll get on this is your character 'transformations' (how much clothes they're wearing). Musous are a pretty braindead genre, but Senran takes it to an entirely new level.
>some good writing
You're joking right? The characters are your typical archetypes and the main plot is the equivalent of getting your toe wet in the concept of gray morality (and this is ignoring how stupid the premise is). It's not even a damn coincidence that the writer for Senran also wrote the shitty story for Fire Emblem Fates' neutral route dlc.
The game's not bad because it has jiggly breasts. It's bad because it's a bad game that tries to get by with jiggly breasts.
And like some of the people who were swamped out by numbers said pretty much said, if you can enjoy a game like this or Neptunia and get upset at people liking just as bland AAA crap like Uncharted or modern Fallout, you're no better than them.
The game is fucking terrible
Considering what you wrote I doubt you played any of the senran games nor any musou for more than 15 minutes so yeah, post discarded. Sorry.>>149767
Nice opinion I guess
You sure showed him
Guy gives exact reasons as to why he disagrees with you. All you do is say he's wrong because he's wrong.
He's factually wrong about the basic aspects of it. I'm not going to discuss a game with someone who has never played it and isn't even trying to judge it fairly, sorry boys
It depresses me when I'm reminded of what a disappointment fallout 4 was.
Then prove him wrong and show how Senran is a great game like you said.
>>149766>if you can enjoy a game like this or Neptunia and get upset at people liking just as bland AAA crap like Uncharted or modern Fallout, you're no better than them.
I agree with this and your opinion on Senran Kagura. I only played one of the spinoff (shinobi versus?) and it was pretty mediocre.
These games get praised solely because of the anime art style and clichés… The Neptunia series is an insult to intelligence and I'm assuming the imageboard posters talking about it are doing it ironically or have outright never played a game in the series. Yet they keep churning out these games and localizing them, so who knows…
By the way… how can wizards stomach the "power of friendship" and patronizing crap about life, love, courage etc in anime?
It should be mentioned that Neptunia (at least a few games in the franchise, not sure if all) was a victim of a very poor "localization" which at times changed entire character's personalities. It's basically the videogame equivalent of moe anime. Personally I never liked it because I find jRPGs boring, but I can see the appeal.
>By the way… how can wizards stomach the "power of friendship" and patronizing crap about life, love, courage etc in anime?
Because anime isn't real life, probably.
novels, theater, movies aren't real life either.
No narrative medium is real.