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If you're reading this, it means you haven't killed yourself yet. So? What's the hold up?
what is even the point of suicide when even if it is in the best case scenario a void and return to nonexistence you won't even be around to enjoy it. There is in a way no such thing as death since subjectively we live forever.
the real hold up is being a pussy and ruminating over life being far far worse dead than alive
the real hold up is being a pussy and ruminating over life being far far worse dead than alive
i dont see why i should kill myself when im going to die anyway. an eternity awaits me in death, so i am in no hurry to throw away my finite life
>>249435
I asked my parents to pay for my therapy. It's expensive but we are upper middle class so it's okay.
I don't want to jump the bridge until my parents passing. Don't want them to see me dead.
I asked my parents to pay for my therapy. It's expensive but we are upper middle class so it's okay.
I don't want to jump the bridge until my parents passing. Don't want them to see me dead.
>>249441
what therapy? I get free therapy and have for years but nothing helps. instead of wasting money on therapy why not read what the therapist reads and also try study yourself and philosophy of mind so you can actually help yourself. Therapy may help but just saying.. if you need therapy to help you feel able to reach for your goals go ahead but if you have no goals you are laying down to rot and die like the rest of us
what therapy? I get free therapy and have for years but nothing helps. instead of wasting money on therapy why not read what the therapist reads and also try study yourself and philosophy of mind so you can actually help yourself. Therapy may help but just saying.. if you need therapy to help you feel able to reach for your goals go ahead but if you have no goals you are laying down to rot and die like the rest of us
>>249436
I agree, it's probably the only thing keeping me from doing it.
Just as I snapped to this body randomly from the void, who's to say I wont again in some other galaxy or planet?
It's irrelevant whether "I" will remember anything or not (I wont since consciousness was just my brain).
Existing itself is the problem. Existence somewhere in the universe is inevitable after countless billion years pass in the void, then you are in the material world again suffering, searching for sustenance, food and water.
There's no escape from the cycle of life. You can just pray you roll a good dice and at least become a being with a life that has minimal suffering.
I agree, it's probably the only thing keeping me from doing it.
Just as I snapped to this body randomly from the void, who's to say I wont again in some other galaxy or planet?
It's irrelevant whether "I" will remember anything or not (I wont since consciousness was just my brain).
Existing itself is the problem. Existence somewhere in the universe is inevitable after countless billion years pass in the void, then you are in the material world again suffering, searching for sustenance, food and water.
There's no escape from the cycle of life. You can just pray you roll a good dice and at least become a being with a life that has minimal suffering.
You know, now that I think about it. Pure spite.
There's this guy's story I heard that sounded EXACTLY like me. I heard he committed suicide. Even though I never met him, it felt like I COMPLETELY understood why, and I felt like I was at this crossroads where I could do the same thing he did or not. And, I figured he already took the suicide approach, so I would see whether or not the normie advice of "It gets better" was true.
It wasn't.
And now I feel like I'm living purely out of spite. Even though I KNOW this is pure schizo reasoning and CAN'T be true, I have this image in my head that I'm the reincarnation of that guy after God tried to have some speech to me about how I shouldn't commit suicide, and gave me the whole normie "It gets better" speech. And now I want to die the hard way just to say to God, "You were wrong."
There's this guy's story I heard that sounded EXACTLY like me. I heard he committed suicide. Even though I never met him, it felt like I COMPLETELY understood why, and I felt like I was at this crossroads where I could do the same thing he did or not. And, I figured he already took the suicide approach, so I would see whether or not the normie advice of "It gets better" was true.
It wasn't.
And now I feel like I'm living purely out of spite. Even though I KNOW this is pure schizo reasoning and CAN'T be true, I have this image in my head that I'm the reincarnation of that guy after God tried to have some speech to me about how I shouldn't commit suicide, and gave me the whole normie "It gets better" speech. And now I want to die the hard way just to say to God, "You were wrong."
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Normies are waiting for my suicide and I don't want to give them the satisfaction, I will outlive all these normalfags and I will piss on their graves.
>>249443
>It's irrelevant whether "I" will remember anything or not
Embed related is worth watching.
>I agree, it's probably the only thing keeping me from doing it.
There is definitely cowardice but even more so the inability to be sure that life will cease and a void is awaiting is enough to send you into violent brainstorms that don't cease.
Existence is the problem as far as our form is concerned. Whilst I am not a determinist in an absolute sense I feel strongly we are in a futile struggle to even be happy and enjoy life as what powers the inner gears are beyond our manipulation. Sure, plenty of depressed people have obstacles within the path of their desires but there are those truly doomed individuals that don't even have a path and are miserable by default just like a faggot in a whore-house I guess.
To DIE is not enough I spend countless hours fantasizing about a way to obliterate myself from existence itself but what is the use of this fanciful poppy cock when the fact is we do exist and in some form or other will always be as long as there is something to be.
We adjust and get used to how shit life is as long as it is a stable kind of shit and you have given up you will survive and that is the a curse let me tell you h'wat. You rot for years you get used to the stench with the right philosophy forged within your being opposed to intellectualized and followed (nearly everyone falls for this meme) nothing will get you down. I envy the wizkids who actually snap when they become homeless or something else and kill themselves "it gets better" no, it never gets better that is counter to reality itself and if it does get better you are only preparing for a nosedive. You just get better at dealing with the stench of shit
>>249451
incase you have not noticed yet, let me fill you in on a secret.
The normalfags do this thing callled sex and spawn more normalfags so this is silly!!
>It's irrelevant whether "I" will remember anything or not
Embed related is worth watching.
>I agree, it's probably the only thing keeping me from doing it.
There is definitely cowardice but even more so the inability to be sure that life will cease and a void is awaiting is enough to send you into violent brainstorms that don't cease.
Existence is the problem as far as our form is concerned. Whilst I am not a determinist in an absolute sense I feel strongly we are in a futile struggle to even be happy and enjoy life as what powers the inner gears are beyond our manipulation. Sure, plenty of depressed people have obstacles within the path of their desires but there are those truly doomed individuals that don't even have a path and are miserable by default just like a faggot in a whore-house I guess.
To DIE is not enough I spend countless hours fantasizing about a way to obliterate myself from existence itself but what is the use of this fanciful poppy cock when the fact is we do exist and in some form or other will always be as long as there is something to be.
We adjust and get used to how shit life is as long as it is a stable kind of shit and you have given up you will survive and that is the a curse let me tell you h'wat. You rot for years you get used to the stench with the right philosophy forged within your being opposed to intellectualized and followed (nearly everyone falls for this meme) nothing will get you down. I envy the wizkids who actually snap when they become homeless or something else and kill themselves "it gets better" no, it never gets better that is counter to reality itself and if it does get better you are only preparing for a nosedive. You just get better at dealing with the stench of shit
>>249451
incase you have not noticed yet, let me fill you in on a secret.
The normalfags do this thing callled sex and spawn more normalfags so this is silly!!
Because my life right now isn't that bad, I live with my dad and I'm NEET again. When he dies and I'm forced into wageslaving though, then I think the real suicidal thoughts will begin. Chances are I still won't do it but looking into the future I can see some real hellish scenario waiting for me if I don't figure things out.
>>249468
here is a tip and a hint.
your helish experiences normalize and and an equilibrium begins. Congratulations no having no food to eat and being homeless is just as bad as when you didn't get that new vidya on your Bday as a kid.
You think homeless niggers exist any other way? thrust massive change upon someone and they may just kill themselves but drip feed the pain and you will be at the BOTTOM of society without a care.
here is a tip and a hint.
your helish experiences normalize and and an equilibrium begins. Congratulations no having no food to eat and being homeless is just as bad as when you didn't get that new vidya on your Bday as a kid.
You think homeless niggers exist any other way? thrust massive change upon someone and they may just kill themselves but drip feed the pain and you will be at the BOTTOM of society without a care.
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>>249435
I feel like i need to do something before i go. My last, bitter, futile "fuck you" to this ultimately indifferent world needs to be expressive. I want to shred my last remains of sanity before i go, live my last days as a free person.
I feel like i need to do something before i go. My last, bitter, futile "fuck you" to this ultimately indifferent world needs to be expressive. I want to shred my last remains of sanity before i go, live my last days as a free person.
>>249435
My mother, she's a wonderful person who tried her best to raise a failure of a disabled son. I try my best in my limited capacity to try and make her smile in pure joy, she deserves that at least for all she has put up with in this shitty world.
My mother, she's a wonderful person who tried her best to raise a failure of a disabled son. I try my best in my limited capacity to try and make her smile in pure joy, she deserves that at least for all she has put up with in this shitty world.
I can't help but think it's something a normie would do. Wizards are the antithesis of normies.
I realized I can just live as a neet with my parents until they die. It's not like I spend a lot of money. My parents get more in social security than the three of us spend together.
>>249452
This is why even the antinatalist humorist proposition of building a gigantic spaceship to obliterate life all around the universe to eradicate suffering permanently doesn't work.
Just as life spawned after waiting for 4+ billion years this round, it will spawn again in a few billion years *somewhere* through star formation, random atoms interacting with each other, water forming, oxygen forming, simple bacteria becoming more and more complex life forms over countless billions of years…
Then here we are again, on Wizchan, 4 billion years later.
We just can't escape this hellish cycle, ever.
Even suicide provides no relief, you don't experience time in the void, you will just exist instantly again somewhere else.
This is why even the antinatalist humorist proposition of building a gigantic spaceship to obliterate life all around the universe to eradicate suffering permanently doesn't work.
Just as life spawned after waiting for 4+ billion years this round, it will spawn again in a few billion years *somewhere* through star formation, random atoms interacting with each other, water forming, oxygen forming, simple bacteria becoming more and more complex life forms over countless billions of years…
Then here we are again, on Wizchan, 4 billion years later.
We just can't escape this hellish cycle, ever.
Even suicide provides no relief, you don't experience time in the void, you will just exist instantly again somewhere else.
None of the methods I've see are things I am actually able to do very easily. Anything that takes a lot of thinking is out and for me this is most of them.
I've made vague plans to travel to the city to put my neck on the rail when a subway comes or maybe go to a bridge.
But I don't know what mental state I'll be in by the time I actually get there and it could be a complete bust or even land me in a psych ward, something I'm very worried about.
I've thought about going into a woods or something but it would need to be somewhere guaranteed that I won't be seen.
It's very easy for people to die by accident but there are tons of others who are seen to be in danger and rescued by people.
It seems like pretty much every method requires a great deal of thinking and preparation which is really hard for me. If it wasn't…I wouldn't be considering suicide in the first place.
SN sounded promising but the antiemetics you have to take can cause akathisia. I believe it is very likely it would trigger intense version of this in me and this could lead to a prolonged freakout and being put in a psych ward.
Everything seems fraught with the potential for worse outcomes…
My ideal suicide would either be gunshot (also carries risks if you don't plan but generally sounds a lot better in all respects) or having a high cliff with no people or traffic to disrupt and cow my autistic brain.
I wish so much that this was just something considered a human right and easy, safe, painless methods were provided to us.
At least you should be able to leave some sign that you don't want to be rescued/revived and have that respected.
Everything seems designed to keep us from leaving.
I've made vague plans to travel to the city to put my neck on the rail when a subway comes or maybe go to a bridge.
But I don't know what mental state I'll be in by the time I actually get there and it could be a complete bust or even land me in a psych ward, something I'm very worried about.
I've thought about going into a woods or something but it would need to be somewhere guaranteed that I won't be seen.
It's very easy for people to die by accident but there are tons of others who are seen to be in danger and rescued by people.
It seems like pretty much every method requires a great deal of thinking and preparation which is really hard for me. If it wasn't…I wouldn't be considering suicide in the first place.
SN sounded promising but the antiemetics you have to take can cause akathisia. I believe it is very likely it would trigger intense version of this in me and this could lead to a prolonged freakout and being put in a psych ward.
Everything seems fraught with the potential for worse outcomes…
My ideal suicide would either be gunshot (also carries risks if you don't plan but generally sounds a lot better in all respects) or having a high cliff with no people or traffic to disrupt and cow my autistic brain.
I wish so much that this was just something considered a human right and easy, safe, painless methods were provided to us.
At least you should be able to leave some sign that you don't want to be rescued/revived and have that respected.
Everything seems designed to keep us from leaving.
>>249510
The general consensus among both wizards and "normies" is the exact opposite of what you just said.
The general consensus among both wizards and "normies" is the exact opposite of what you just said.
>>249643
The vast majority of people who kill themselves are normies. Suffering is so foreign to normies that when they get a taste of it they want to quit immediately. For normies their suffering is typically the result of failed optimism. Being optimists at heart, it's that which drives the normie to kill themself.
As with everything in life, I think killing oneself is pointless. I am simply not optimistic enough for suicide.
The vast majority of people who kill themselves are normies. Suffering is so foreign to normies that when they get a taste of it they want to quit immediately. For normies their suffering is typically the result of failed optimism. Being optimists at heart, it's that which drives the normie to kill themself.
As with everything in life, I think killing oneself is pointless. I am simply not optimistic enough for suicide.
>>249655
The first part is kind of true but on the second, you're just coping. It's cringe-worthy. You're not better than anyone else in any possible aspect.
The first part is kind of true but on the second, you're just coping. It's cringe-worthy. You're not better than anyone else in any possible aspect.
>>249443
>Just as I snapped to this body randomly from the void, who's to say I wont again in some other galaxy or planet?
The lack of evidence for it, why would you believe that the default condition is of a human intelligence, or some kind of thinking brain for that matter.
all our thoughts and knowledge about reality are learned though our past experiences, they are merely stored in our biological brains and utilized to more effectively create offspring.
we have evidence for this fact in seeing degenerative mental diseases that eventually erase all of a person's memories, and eventually all their intelligent thoughts. IE: dementia.
theories about life after death like reincarnation are so easy to believe because it's difficult to imagine non-existence, because to you, you have always existed, and always will until death
>Just as I snapped to this body randomly from the void, who's to say I wont again in some other galaxy or planet?
The lack of evidence for it, why would you believe that the default condition is of a human intelligence, or some kind of thinking brain for that matter.
all our thoughts and knowledge about reality are learned though our past experiences, they are merely stored in our biological brains and utilized to more effectively create offspring.
we have evidence for this fact in seeing degenerative mental diseases that eventually erase all of a person's memories, and eventually all their intelligent thoughts. IE: dementia.
theories about life after death like reincarnation are so easy to believe because it's difficult to imagine non-existence, because to you, you have always existed, and always will until death
>>249679
furthermore, you never "snapped to intelligent life"
your mother chose to have sex with a man, got pregnant, and gave birth to infant you.
infants know nothing when they are born, and in fact much like an animal, babies don't have a sense of self, or any kind of ego.
you can't remember any of this of course, however this has been scientifically proven through studies on very early childhood brain development.
the truth is you were forming your own perception of reality from the moment of your birth.
you saw with your eyes, heard with your ears, and learned how to act like a human from other humans.
the human brain is a very fascinating thing…
furthermore, you never "snapped to intelligent life"
your mother chose to have sex with a man, got pregnant, and gave birth to infant you.
infants know nothing when they are born, and in fact much like an animal, babies don't have a sense of self, or any kind of ego.
you can't remember any of this of course, however this has been scientifically proven through studies on very early childhood brain development.
the truth is you were forming your own perception of reality from the moment of your birth.
you saw with your eyes, heard with your ears, and learned how to act like a human from other humans.
the human brain is a very fascinating thing…
>>249435
I'm feeling way too numb because my life hasn't crumbled yet. Unfortunately our programming for survival is way too strong, I've been walking over the edge of the cliff for years, but taking the single step forward I need is too difficult, I need someone to push me, however I feel like that might happen soon enough, just not now because things are a little slow, not that I'm complaining, but when things pick up again and I'm stressed all of the time every single day then something might push me.
I'm feeling way too numb because my life hasn't crumbled yet. Unfortunately our programming for survival is way too strong, I've been walking over the edge of the cliff for years, but taking the single step forward I need is too difficult, I need someone to push me, however I feel like that might happen soon enough, just not now because things are a little slow, not that I'm complaining, but when things pick up again and I'm stressed all of the time every single day then something might push me.
>>249679
> theories about life after death like reincarnation are so easy to believe because it's difficult to imagine non-existence, because to you, you have always existed, and always will until death
damm right
> theories about life after death like reincarnation are so easy to believe because it's difficult to imagine non-existence, because to you, you have always existed, and always will until death
damm right
I'm afraid I'll botch it up and guns are illegal in my shithole. Also even if it seems like the only logical conclusion to my life, my stupid survival instinct just convinces me I prefer to live and wait for a miracle/war/anything to happen.
I'm thinking about it everyday, I have no hope for life, I'm completely apathetic, but I can't kill myself for some reason.
I'm thinking about it everyday, I have no hope for life, I'm completely apathetic, but I can't kill myself for some reason.
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>>249629
>Then here we are again, on Wizchan, 4 billion years later.
the idea that there may be a wizchan billions of years from now out there somewhere in time and space actually gave me a little comfort. thanks wizzy.
>Then here we are again, on Wizchan, 4 billion years later.
the idea that there may be a wizchan billions of years from now out there somewhere in time and space actually gave me a little comfort. thanks wizzy.
I refuse to give up until I have achieved the life I desire. Only once I reach that and it turns out to still be shit can I kill myself.
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>>249435
being a lame cunt.
there was this time when I talked to a guy about comittig suicide, he told me ¨lol just grow a pair dude¨, yes, when I grow a pair I will kill myself, why the fuck do you think I'm still here wasting the time of other people with myself?.
being a lame cunt.
there was this time when I talked to a guy about comittig suicide, he told me ¨lol just grow a pair dude¨, yes, when I grow a pair I will kill myself, why the fuck do you think I'm still here wasting the time of other people with myself?.
Well, I heard my country went and had men die so I can have this little thing called pursuit of happiness, so I decided to take it after years of going back and forth with the idea. I figure - worst case scenario, and I fail everything, I just go down to the hardware and pick up rope and be done with it all. It's like - it's no cost to try to live and do the best with what I was gifted with. Also, I feel like blowing my head off every time I come off klonopin, I have been trying to steer clear of those that way I don't do anything impulsive, they're not really necessary either, alcohol does the job fine in my opinion.
>>252706
> I figure - worst case scenario, and I fail everything, I just go down to the hardware and pick up rope and be done with it all. It's like - it's no cost to try to live and do the best with what I was gifted with.
This is my view as well. I don’t get this rush to die, what are you gonna miss out on?
> I figure - worst case scenario, and I fail everything, I just go down to the hardware and pick up rope and be done with it all. It's like - it's no cost to try to live and do the best with what I was gifted with.
This is my view as well. I don’t get this rush to die, what are you gonna miss out on?
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>assuming most of us are capable of suicide
This is the ultimate cope! "Oh if it gets bad I will just off myself like that!4bam!haha fuck you life!" Morons. Most of us will never do it. I tried it numerous times and it isn't easy at all.
Basically what happened is I grew up and accepted that I will never have the courage to do it, nor the energy nor the motivation. Yes, simply being depressed and having existential crisis isn't enough in my experience. You need some tragic or shocking thing to happen that would boost your motivation. Idk, like going homeless? Or parents dying? Who knows, though I doubt I would even kill myself in those cases. After all this, though…do I even want to kill myself? I realized in these past few days that I don't really hate life as much as I believed. I had a good life up until now, all things considered. So turns out I actually like living, funny that is.
In short, what I hate is other people, not life itself.
This is the ultimate cope! "Oh if it gets bad I will just off myself like that!4bam!haha fuck you life!" Morons. Most of us will never do it. I tried it numerous times and it isn't easy at all.
Basically what happened is I grew up and accepted that I will never have the courage to do it, nor the energy nor the motivation. Yes, simply being depressed and having existential crisis isn't enough in my experience. You need some tragic or shocking thing to happen that would boost your motivation. Idk, like going homeless? Or parents dying? Who knows, though I doubt I would even kill myself in those cases. After all this, though…do I even want to kill myself? I realized in these past few days that I don't really hate life as much as I believed. I had a good life up until now, all things considered. So turns out I actually like living, funny that is.
In short, what I hate is other people, not life itself.
>>252711
What does it matter if you suffer a lot or a little before you die? You’ll end up at the exact same place.
What does it matter if you suffer a lot or a little before you die? You’ll end up at the exact same place.
>>252713
>You’ll end up at the exact same place.
Then it's beneficial to suffer less, ideally kill yourself before suffering begins each time.
>You’ll end up at the exact same place.
Then it's beneficial to suffer less, ideally kill yourself before suffering begins each time.
>>252716
>then it’s beneficial to suffer less
Beneficial to who? You? Cause you’ll be dead. You won’t benefit from anything.
>then it’s beneficial to suffer less
Beneficial to who? You? Cause you’ll be dead. You won’t benefit from anything.
>>252714
It is only pointless to your nihilistic mind. Sucks to be you, I guess.
Suffering is never without aim or purpose. It makes us stronger or richer in experiences. Without suffering life would be boring.
It is only pointless to your nihilistic mind. Sucks to be you, I guess.
Suffering is never without aim or purpose. It makes us stronger or richer in experiences. Without suffering life would be boring.
>>252737
Suffering gives us knowledge, wisdom, character, endurance, humility, etc. Should I seriously go on? Suffering has its uses. Only a retarded hedonist or pessimist wouldn't appreciate suffering.
Suffering gives us knowledge, wisdom, character, endurance, humility, etc. Should I seriously go on? Suffering has its uses. Only a retarded hedonist or pessimist wouldn't appreciate suffering.
>>252757
Maybe if you're a well-adjusted person or in moderation.
If your entire life is nothing but suffering you end up like a retarded, rabid animal.
Maybe if you're a well-adjusted person or in moderation.
If your entire life is nothing but suffering you end up like a retarded, rabid animal.
>>249435
im convinced about God and that human is the class of creatures is considered 'very good' according to God, so even if i don't like existing very much, i cannot kill myself without it being very disrespectful towards God
killing myself is going from a little suffering to risking a lot of suffering on the other side, that is frightening
im convinced about God and that human is the class of creatures is considered 'very good' according to God, so even if i don't like existing very much, i cannot kill myself without it being very disrespectful towards God
killing myself is going from a little suffering to risking a lot of suffering on the other side, that is frightening
>>252769
Nobody's life is made up of pure suffering. This is because suffering and pleasure aren't mutually exclusive, you can experience both at the same time.
>>252770
Suffering is useful, only weak people like you don't want to acknowledge it. I suffered a great deal for a year or so, I couldn't anything else besides simple stuff like bread and etc otherwise I would get horrible stomach pains. Yet I am grateful for the experience, I learned a good deal during my sickness.
>>252776
I'm not religious, I'm just not a teenage succubus who finds every kind of pain/suffering to be the devil itself. I was like you once, now I think differently since I'm older and more experienced. Suffering has benefited me GREATLY. It showed me things I otherwise wouldn't have seen, it made understand deeper meanings about reality and nature too.
Nobody's life is made up of pure suffering. This is because suffering and pleasure aren't mutually exclusive, you can experience both at the same time.
>>252770
Suffering is useful, only weak people like you don't want to acknowledge it. I suffered a great deal for a year or so, I couldn't anything else besides simple stuff like bread and etc otherwise I would get horrible stomach pains. Yet I am grateful for the experience, I learned a good deal during my sickness.
>>252776
I'm not religious, I'm just not a teenage succubus who finds every kind of pain/suffering to be the devil itself. I was like you once, now I think differently since I'm older and more experienced. Suffering has benefited me GREATLY. It showed me things I otherwise wouldn't have seen, it made understand deeper meanings about reality and nature too.
>>252825
How about yes? Your line of thinking is a fruitless dead end. My line of thinking leads to power, wisdom, truth, self-knowledge and many other useful things. Think about what your life would be like if there was no suffering at all
>wake up
>oh everything is all right
>day ends
It would be boring like a bitch.
How about yes? Your line of thinking is a fruitless dead end. My line of thinking leads to power, wisdom, truth, self-knowledge and many other useful things. Think about what your life would be like if there was no suffering at all
>wake up
>oh everything is all right
>day ends
It would be boring like a bitch.
>>252827
Your line of thinking leads to doo-doo, feces, incontinence, shartstains, skidmarks, diarrhea and stinky smells!
This is the only response your shitty posts deserve.
Your line of thinking leads to doo-doo, feces, incontinence, shartstains, skidmarks, diarrhea and stinky smells!
This is the only response your shitty posts deserve.
>>252779
here is a tier list to make it simple for you
1. love
2. respect
3. indifference
4. disrespect
5. very disrespectful
and being afraid of God or His zeal is far from ideal, the ideal is to love Him, that means you are mistaken on the 'trauma' part
>>252787
probably trying to argue using biblical terms to make a point that is hard to refute, which is silly because this isn't academia
here is a tier list to make it simple for you
1. love
2. respect
3. indifference
4. disrespect
5. very disrespectful
and being afraid of God or His zeal is far from ideal, the ideal is to love Him, that means you are mistaken on the 'trauma' part
>>252787
probably trying to argue using biblical terms to make a point that is hard to refute, which is silly because this isn't academia
>>249435
Noose doesn't work, can't get a gun, nembutal is expensive as shit, I dont like feeling too much pain so not going to drink acid or cut my neck, SN is literally rarer than diamonds these days, etc
If you guys have a link to a SN vendor or N that's cheap or even a gun just let me know here
Noose doesn't work, can't get a gun, nembutal is expensive as shit, I dont like feeling too much pain so not going to drink acid or cut my neck, SN is literally rarer than diamonds these days, etc
If you guys have a link to a SN vendor or N that's cheap or even a gun just let me know here
>>252841
No, it is true. The things I suffered changed me in ways that are priceless to me. Wouldn't have life any other way.
No, it is true. The things I suffered changed me in ways that are priceless to me. Wouldn't have life any other way.
>>252887
At least in the US, literally 3 of the first 4 results on amazon for the search term "sodium nitrite" are >95%-purity lab-grade powder. They have slow international shipping, but it's a lot better than nothing.
At least in the US, literally 3 of the first 4 results on amazon for the search term "sodium nitrite" are >95%-purity lab-grade powder. They have slow international shipping, but it's a lot better than nothing.
>>252720
ok bro let me just cut your arm off, what do you mean no? you might learn something, like how arms are useful, mkay.
ok bro let me just cut your arm off, what do you mean no? you might learn something, like how arms are useful, mkay.
>>252906
Yea I know the US has SN on amazon but sadly I am not in burgerland. Americans and some third world shitholes have so much resources to kill themselves with like guns, nembutal, sn, acids that can create carbon monoxide and hydrogen sulfide, etc
If it wasn't for their faith in religion I bet a lot of third worlders would have killed themselves
Yea I know the US has SN on amazon but sadly I am not in burgerland. Americans and some third world shitholes have so much resources to kill themselves with like guns, nembutal, sn, acids that can create carbon monoxide and hydrogen sulfide, etc
If it wasn't for their faith in religion I bet a lot of third worlders would have killed themselves
File: 1642063574767.jpg (18.27 KB, 500x369, 500:369, 1005454982924161025-DfQTKM….jpg) ImgOps iqdb
If anyone needs a recommendation for committing suicide I've narrowed my choices down to three: heroin overdose, sodium nitrate overdose, or jumping from a bridge. I've done some research into different methods and those three seem to be around the cheapest, generally pain free, and least amount of time consuming.
I'm turning 30 this year and I told myself that if I didn't get my shit together by my birthday then I'd kill myself. Six months to go wizards!
I'm turning 30 this year and I told myself that if I didn't get my shit together by my birthday then I'd kill myself. Six months to go wizards!
My worry is what would happen if the method of my suicide fails: would someone else intervene? Would I be a vegetable?
>>252915
Seeing a point or reason to suffering/accepting it is as a fundamental part of life or actively seeking it out are two different things. The first is called a healthy mindset, the latter a masochist.
Seeing a point or reason to suffering/accepting it is as a fundamental part of life or actively seeking it out are two different things. The first is called a healthy mindset, the latter a masochist.
It seems like a huge fucking hassle.
And I am absolutely terrified of the possibility of an afterlife or some form of reincarnation.
And I am absolutely terrified of the possibility of an afterlife or some form of reincarnation.
>>252970
Yes. "Life is a pendulum that swings from suffering to boredom" (Schopenhauer) or something like that.
Yes. "Life is a pendulum that swings from suffering to boredom" (Schopenhauer) or something like that.
>>252948
There's a difference between accepting it as part of life and giving some dumb blanket statement like "no suffering is pointless". Lots of pain and suffering is pointless and no amount of silver lining look on the bright side poo poo shit will change that.
There's a difference between accepting it as part of life and giving some dumb blanket statement like "no suffering is pointless". Lots of pain and suffering is pointless and no amount of silver lining look on the bright side poo poo shit will change that.
Oh boy, make a statement about suffering not being bad and there comes the faggot army of pessimists, nihilists and hedonists to gang up on me.
>>253004
No, suffering is never pointless. If it happened, it happens for a reason. Either to break you or to make you. Never useless in either case. Most people here are acting like ignorant children, refusing to acknowledge that suffering is a useful and beneficial part of life. Suffering is the very essence of life, one could say. If there is no suffering, it is just death.
>>252970
>>252996
First, Schopenhauer was a hypocrite faggot and all pessimism is nothing but acting and shitty dramatics, hypocrites pretending they hate life while they don't. Second, no boredom isn't suffering at all. Do you guys even know what suffering is? Or are you just some whiny bitches? Because to me the latter seems to be the case. You are bored exactly if you don't suffer. Boredom is a sign that you don't have any actual problems, I'm sorry. Schope was a rich aristocrat who never had to experience any truly difficult trials in his life, he lived the easy life and like to complain, pretty much what you people are like too I think.
>>252960
How does God come into this whole thing? Read what I write. About boring and all right see what I replied to others in this post. If things are all right, then they are boring. Exciting things or events are dangerous or even cause you some kind of discomfort or suffering.
>>253004
No, suffering is never pointless. If it happened, it happens for a reason. Either to break you or to make you. Never useless in either case. Most people here are acting like ignorant children, refusing to acknowledge that suffering is a useful and beneficial part of life. Suffering is the very essence of life, one could say. If there is no suffering, it is just death.
>>252970
>>252996
First, Schopenhauer was a hypocrite faggot and all pessimism is nothing but acting and shitty dramatics, hypocrites pretending they hate life while they don't. Second, no boredom isn't suffering at all. Do you guys even know what suffering is? Or are you just some whiny bitches? Because to me the latter seems to be the case. You are bored exactly if you don't suffer. Boredom is a sign that you don't have any actual problems, I'm sorry. Schope was a rich aristocrat who never had to experience any truly difficult trials in his life, he lived the easy life and like to complain, pretty much what you people are like too I think.
>>252960
How does God come into this whole thing? Read what I write. About boring and all right see what I replied to others in this post. If things are all right, then they are boring. Exciting things or events are dangerous or even cause you some kind of discomfort or suffering.
>>253006
Yes and that is why people here should toughen up a little already. You'd think after a while wallowing in self-pity and the pity of others would get old, but apparently some people like being weak and defenseless and then complain about bad things happening to them, as if they couldn't change anything.
Yes and that is why people here should toughen up a little already. You'd think after a while wallowing in self-pity and the pity of others would get old, but apparently some people like being weak and defenseless and then complain about bad things happening to them, as if they couldn't change anything.
>>249435
i was a religious person , and every time i come to off myself i remember that i could end up in a place worse than where im right now
also i could be reincarnated again in this miserable life
i know it's my brain defense mechanism that kicks in , but at the end of the day i can't do it
i was a religious person , and every time i come to off myself i remember that i could end up in a place worse than where im right now
also i could be reincarnated again in this miserable life
i know it's my brain defense mechanism that kicks in , but at the end of the day i can't do it
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It appears that the gods will not allow me to self destruct just yet. There is still a task that I must fulfill before I exit the stage. The only problem is that I don't know what it is.
i had a plan, i aimed power, to be some one in my shithole subcalled city and i have fallen, with all the theatricality in implies
>>253005
This is just some way that some people who suffer misfortunes try to make themselves feel better by tricking themselves that they really are better off because of it. I went through a 2-year-long phase of that after reading Nietzsche and Deleuze, so I find it very trite and a bit too dramatic.
It's only when you can more detach from it all that you can you look at it a bit more objectively with an aristocratic cold disdain, like Schopenhauer and Lovecraft (interestingly, one an extreme idealist and the other an extreme materalist).
>"Life itself is a sea full of rocks and whirlpools that man avoids with the greatest caution and care, although he knows that, even when he succeeds with all his efforts and ingenuity in struggling through, at every step he comes nearer to the greatest, the total, the inevitable and irremediable shipwreck, indeed even steers right on to it, namely death." - World as Will and Representation, § 57.
Suffering is useful (sometimes) because it helps you navigate more accurately the "sea full of rocks and whirlpools." But regardless of how amazing you become at it you still arrive at the "irremediable shipwreck." So these lessons and insights are ultimately futile and pointless.
>Suffering is useful because it helps you achieve X
And why is X useful?
>X is useful to achieve Y, which helps achieve Z
And why is Z useful?
>Because… well, because it's desirable in itself and means you're some Übermensch badass
But even achieving Z is ultimately pointless. You then die and it all fades away and is forgotten forever as if it had never existed in the first place.
Now, you can be an idealist like Schopenhauer and believe that consciousness and "The world is my representation" is eternal and infinite, with no beginning and no end. Or you can be a staunch materialist like Lovecraft and believe that the universe is purely composed of particles and their meaningless motions, and it would make no difference for the value of one's own life. If my consciousness has always and will always exist, then infinite lifetimes full of the greatest wonders and horrors, and Herculean achievements and catastrophic failures, have all already been forgotten, as will this lifetime as soon as it is over. (Sometimes I think of how the most vivid, long, and magical dreams are forgotten as soon I open my eyes.)
I sincerely hope the materalists are right since no idea could be more soothing and comforting than that my consciousness only exists for a brief and finite period of time, but I have my doubts and I'm afraid the worst of all possible cases is correct.
This is just some way that some people who suffer misfortunes try to make themselves feel better by tricking themselves that they really are better off because of it. I went through a 2-year-long phase of that after reading Nietzsche and Deleuze, so I find it very trite and a bit too dramatic.
It's only when you can more detach from it all that you can you look at it a bit more objectively with an aristocratic cold disdain, like Schopenhauer and Lovecraft (interestingly, one an extreme idealist and the other an extreme materalist).
>"Life itself is a sea full of rocks and whirlpools that man avoids with the greatest caution and care, although he knows that, even when he succeeds with all his efforts and ingenuity in struggling through, at every step he comes nearer to the greatest, the total, the inevitable and irremediable shipwreck, indeed even steers right on to it, namely death." - World as Will and Representation, § 57.
Suffering is useful (sometimes) because it helps you navigate more accurately the "sea full of rocks and whirlpools." But regardless of how amazing you become at it you still arrive at the "irremediable shipwreck." So these lessons and insights are ultimately futile and pointless.
>Suffering is useful because it helps you achieve X
And why is X useful?
>X is useful to achieve Y, which helps achieve Z
And why is Z useful?
>Because… well, because it's desirable in itself and means you're some Übermensch badass
But even achieving Z is ultimately pointless. You then die and it all fades away and is forgotten forever as if it had never existed in the first place.
Now, you can be an idealist like Schopenhauer and believe that consciousness and "The world is my representation" is eternal and infinite, with no beginning and no end. Or you can be a staunch materialist like Lovecraft and believe that the universe is purely composed of particles and their meaningless motions, and it would make no difference for the value of one's own life. If my consciousness has always and will always exist, then infinite lifetimes full of the greatest wonders and horrors, and Herculean achievements and catastrophic failures, have all already been forgotten, as will this lifetime as soon as it is over. (Sometimes I think of how the most vivid, long, and magical dreams are forgotten as soon I open my eyes.)
I sincerely hope the materalists are right since no idea could be more soothing and comforting than that my consciousness only exists for a brief and finite period of time, but I have my doubts and I'm afraid the worst of all possible cases is correct.
>>252720
>Suffering is never without aim or purpose. It makes us stronger or richer in experiences. Without suffering life would be boring.
And without life there is neither boredom nor suffering nor stronger and richer experiences, or any experiences for that matter, which is the whole point of the discussion.
There is no aim or purpose, it's only invented afterwards. You know, even your daddy Nietzsche said that last one.
>Suffering is never without aim or purpose. It makes us stronger or richer in experiences. Without suffering life would be boring.
And without life there is neither boredom nor suffering nor stronger and richer experiences, or any experiences for that matter, which is the whole point of the discussion.
There is no aim or purpose, it's only invented afterwards. You know, even your daddy Nietzsche said that last one.
>>253072
Like that other poster I have no interest in pessimism, which is why I tend not to post on /dep/ except for when my melancholy overwhelms me. If you truly believe that life is nothing but suffering then you have a lifetime to rectify that problem yet your type chooses to whine on imageboards instead of taking this opportunity. I am not one that believes that the immediate passions are the greatest dimension of human feeling, but I believe that it is possible to detach the self from these sensatations and view them with the rational faculty, at which point you realise that these sensations are unimportant in the grand scheme of things.
>>253103
I'd prefer not to gain my wisdom from a superstitious popular cult.
Like that other poster I have no interest in pessimism, which is why I tend not to post on /dep/ except for when my melancholy overwhelms me. If you truly believe that life is nothing but suffering then you have a lifetime to rectify that problem yet your type chooses to whine on imageboards instead of taking this opportunity. I am not one that believes that the immediate passions are the greatest dimension of human feeling, but I believe that it is possible to detach the self from these sensatations and view them with the rational faculty, at which point you realise that these sensations are unimportant in the grand scheme of things.
>>253103
I'd prefer not to gain my wisdom from a superstitious popular cult.
>>252720
So I've been suffering from my loneliness, anhedonia and complete lack of ambition or care for about a decade now. What is the point exactly?
>It makes us stronger or richer in experiences.
I have had no experiences at all and I feel incredibly weak and tired all the time. I think you have a very warped, romantic view of what suffering can entail. And no I'm far from a nihilist, you're not even using that term right. You're not very clever at all.
So I've been suffering from my loneliness, anhedonia and complete lack of ambition or care for about a decade now. What is the point exactly?
>It makes us stronger or richer in experiences.
I have had no experiences at all and I feel incredibly weak and tired all the time. I think you have a very warped, romantic view of what suffering can entail. And no I'm far from a nihilist, you're not even using that term right. You're not very clever at all.
>>253136
yeah lol. nihilism would call suffering neutral. Calling suffering bad isn't nihilism.
yeah lol. nihilism would call suffering neutral. Calling suffering bad isn't nihilism.
>>253137
I think it's best to just avoid the term nihilism for the most part. It has too much baggage and has practically become meaningless. Virtually everything has been referred to as nihilist or nihilistic by all sorts of different groups. Buddhism, Christianity, atheitistic materialism, idealism (like Schopenhauer and von Hartmann), communism, fascism, etc. Hell, even Nietzsche has been called a nihilist despite him being the one who used to call nearly everything nihilist as a criticism.
Usually these people are just using it to dismiss some other group or position with "vague scary word" as in "what you're saying is actually nihilist therefore you're wrong and I don't have to articulate why."
It's worse when people actually self-describe as nihilists. It's always edgy and annoying teenagers and it's always very embarrassing. I shudder remembering when I was one of them.
I think it's best to just avoid the term nihilism for the most part. It has too much baggage and has practically become meaningless. Virtually everything has been referred to as nihilist or nihilistic by all sorts of different groups. Buddhism, Christianity, atheitistic materialism, idealism (like Schopenhauer and von Hartmann), communism, fascism, etc. Hell, even Nietzsche has been called a nihilist despite him being the one who used to call nearly everything nihilist as a criticism.
Usually these people are just using it to dismiss some other group or position with "vague scary word" as in "what you're saying is actually nihilist therefore you're wrong and I don't have to articulate why."
It's worse when people actually self-describe as nihilists. It's always edgy and annoying teenagers and it's always very embarrassing. I shudder remembering when I was one of them.
>>253153
> It's worse when people actually self-describe as nihilists. It's always edgy and annoying teenagers and it's always very embarrassing. I shudder remembering when I was one of them.
Holy shit get over yourself dude.
> It's worse when people actually self-describe as nihilists. It's always edgy and annoying teenagers and it's always very embarrassing. I shudder remembering when I was one of them.
Holy shit get over yourself dude.
>>253070
Hm, this made me laugh.
1. "Death as shipwreck"
Now you only whine again, this is all pessimists can do. "Oh I hate life it is suffering! But death is a bad thing too! Waawaaa!" You see how stupid and self-defeating/contradictory your whole ideology is? Because pessimism isn't an ideology or philosophy in the true sense, it is a degeneration and sickness that shows us the end of a culture is near at hand. It is just an excuse for whining without end and empty angst. I say this as a former pessimist.
2. "Why is suffering useful?" "Why is X useful?" etc.
You could use this childish attitude towards everything. Why do you care so much about suffering? Why would a life without suffering be useful? What does it matter to you if you suffer? Your nihilism backfires on you nicely.
Death isn't a negative thing, suffering isn't either. Both are necessary parts of life and they give our lives nobility, weight and even meaning. What would the point of living eternally in hedonism or peace? Death gives us a limited time, therefore makes life interesting. Suffering also gives life a taste that would be otherwise lacking, adversity and low-points are necessary in order to fully experience what life has to offer.
3. I definitely believe life and consciousness continues in some form or another. Death is the beginning of something new. And I look forward to the other worlds I get to experience too. I don't care that much about the pseudo-buddhism of Schope but I believe in life itself contuing in some way. Whether it is hell dimensions or something akin to Heaven, that is only secondary.
4. So what is the actual "cope", by the way? That life is worth living and if you fail in this life it matters or what you advocate, that nothing matters? To me, it seems like your view is the cope. You dismiss life entirely as something negative, because you fear failure and suffering to insane levels.
>>253071
I don't care about Nietzsche, unlike you people I'm not some bot who parrots the opinions of dead men as the ultimate wisdom. I'm talking on my own authority pretty much. There is aim and purpose to life, I know it. It is to live honestly to yourself and in accordance with your nature. Experience life in your own unique way.
>>253136
The point is to live your life. Your loneliness, anhedonia and lack of ambition are part of you too. You are still at the part of being made. Suffering makes you or breaks you. Either you perish or you will triumph in the face of trials. You will know your fate soon enough. Everyone has experiences, even rotting away in your room doing nothing is an experience that is worth it. I'm not really a romantic either, the only romantic trait I have is that I believe in an afterlife. I know full well that life isn't roses and sunshine. But to live is to exactly give the middle finger and push on, to see what fate has in store for you. By being a coward and a pussy you are working against yourself. You guys want to escape suffering at all cost but ironically you are suffering from yourselves the most and from this mentality of yours. You want the results but not the struggle or effort.
>nihilism
It has multiple meanings, so I use it correctly. You read up on how much things it defines. You people are nihilists because you don't believe life has any meaning at all. Most thought system that views suffering as evil tends to end up with a nihilistic result.
>>253153
When you want to run away from life because of suffering that makes you a nihilist. Because it implies you only value comfort/peace or pleasure, therefore you think the world is without inherent meaning.
Hm, this made me laugh.
1. "Death as shipwreck"
Now you only whine again, this is all pessimists can do. "Oh I hate life it is suffering! But death is a bad thing too! Waawaaa!" You see how stupid and self-defeating/contradictory your whole ideology is? Because pessimism isn't an ideology or philosophy in the true sense, it is a degeneration and sickness that shows us the end of a culture is near at hand. It is just an excuse for whining without end and empty angst. I say this as a former pessimist.
2. "Why is suffering useful?" "Why is X useful?" etc.
You could use this childish attitude towards everything. Why do you care so much about suffering? Why would a life without suffering be useful? What does it matter to you if you suffer? Your nihilism backfires on you nicely.
Death isn't a negative thing, suffering isn't either. Both are necessary parts of life and they give our lives nobility, weight and even meaning. What would the point of living eternally in hedonism or peace? Death gives us a limited time, therefore makes life interesting. Suffering also gives life a taste that would be otherwise lacking, adversity and low-points are necessary in order to fully experience what life has to offer.
3. I definitely believe life and consciousness continues in some form or another. Death is the beginning of something new. And I look forward to the other worlds I get to experience too. I don't care that much about the pseudo-buddhism of Schope but I believe in life itself contuing in some way. Whether it is hell dimensions or something akin to Heaven, that is only secondary.
4. So what is the actual "cope", by the way? That life is worth living and if you fail in this life it matters or what you advocate, that nothing matters? To me, it seems like your view is the cope. You dismiss life entirely as something negative, because you fear failure and suffering to insane levels.
>>253071
I don't care about Nietzsche, unlike you people I'm not some bot who parrots the opinions of dead men as the ultimate wisdom. I'm talking on my own authority pretty much. There is aim and purpose to life, I know it. It is to live honestly to yourself and in accordance with your nature. Experience life in your own unique way.
>>253136
The point is to live your life. Your loneliness, anhedonia and lack of ambition are part of you too. You are still at the part of being made. Suffering makes you or breaks you. Either you perish or you will triumph in the face of trials. You will know your fate soon enough. Everyone has experiences, even rotting away in your room doing nothing is an experience that is worth it. I'm not really a romantic either, the only romantic trait I have is that I believe in an afterlife. I know full well that life isn't roses and sunshine. But to live is to exactly give the middle finger and push on, to see what fate has in store for you. By being a coward and a pussy you are working against yourself. You guys want to escape suffering at all cost but ironically you are suffering from yourselves the most and from this mentality of yours. You want the results but not the struggle or effort.
>nihilism
It has multiple meanings, so I use it correctly. You read up on how much things it defines. You people are nihilists because you don't believe life has any meaning at all. Most thought system that views suffering as evil tends to end up with a nihilistic result.
>>253153
When you want to run away from life because of suffering that makes you a nihilist. Because it implies you only value comfort/peace or pleasure, therefore you think the world is without inherent meaning.
>>253161
I assume Nietzsche would agree with you, seeing as much of his work is devoted to deconstructing philosophy.
I assume Nietzsche would agree with you, seeing as much of his work is devoted to deconstructing philosophy.
>>253161
Here we go again with the vague platitudes. "Live your life.", meaning what exactly? Posting pompous condescending advice on wizchan to make yourself feel superior, I assume. Your middle finger and push on attitude completely side-steps over the anhedonia, if you don't feel any enjoyment out of anything, then you want nothing, so pushing on means nothing to me. Push on to what. I don't want to escape suffering, suffering is an inescapable part of existence, it is the entire point of life, in fact, if you want to talk about meaning. We suffer because we are being punished for our fallen nature. I don't want the results, I don't even know what the results mean, and the concept of happiness is alien to me. I don't deserve happiness and if I somehow achieved it (actually impossible) it would be wrong.
I never said life has no meaning, I said suffering doesn't necessarily have a point. It can, but not always. And no nihilism doesn't have several meanings, you just don't understand it which is embarrassing since it's a middle schooler's philosophy.
Here we go again with the vague platitudes. "Live your life.", meaning what exactly? Posting pompous condescending advice on wizchan to make yourself feel superior, I assume. Your middle finger and push on attitude completely side-steps over the anhedonia, if you don't feel any enjoyment out of anything, then you want nothing, so pushing on means nothing to me. Push on to what. I don't want to escape suffering, suffering is an inescapable part of existence, it is the entire point of life, in fact, if you want to talk about meaning. We suffer because we are being punished for our fallen nature. I don't want the results, I don't even know what the results mean, and the concept of happiness is alien to me. I don't deserve happiness and if I somehow achieved it (actually impossible) it would be wrong.
I never said life has no meaning, I said suffering doesn't necessarily have a point. It can, but not always. And no nihilism doesn't have several meanings, you just don't understand it which is embarrassing since it's a middle schooler's philosophy.
I'm accustomed to my life in the current state it is now. I will consider suicide the moment my mother died but otherwise I don't mind this existence.
I also could never kill myself while my mom is alive. I have a very good relationship with her and she's the only person I like. I've read of stories of the pain of parents losing their sons to suicide and it's seems to be one of the worst things a person can experience.
I wish instead of me she'd had a son who could've been more successful for her.
I wish instead of me she'd had a son who could've been more successful for her.
I don't want to die in my hometown or country and I'd rather wait until my grandparents are dead before I do it.
>>253175
Sounds like she abused you and turned you into a slave instead of supporting you to build independence. Many cases like this. One day you may see through it and your perception of her can shift completely
Sounds like she abused you and turned you into a slave instead of supporting you to build independence. Many cases like this. One day you may see through it and your perception of her can shift completely
>>253184
>One day you may see through it and your perception of her can shift completely
Indeed. I wish she'd become a nun instead of breeding.
>One day you may see through it and your perception of her can shift completely
Indeed. I wish she'd become a nun instead of breeding.
>>253162
He was right in that, pre-existentialism philosophy was nothing but cheap talk.
>>253163
God, do I have to spell everything out for you? Live your life, as in continue existing? You could start with that. Not like you will kill yourself anyway, we both know it. It is just empty roleplaying and masquerade. All talk and hypocrisy, this is what pessimism is. You don't want anything? Yeah sure Buddha, then why do you reply to my posts? Coult it be, gosh, you want to prove me wrong? O that can't be, after all you don't want anything in life. How could you want anything? Wanting anything is so healthy and it would actually give you a reason to do things, better pretend you don't want anything, you know, to fit in with the true wizards here. If you pretend you don't want anything, then nobody can hurt you, after all. This is the whole point of pessimism. A cowardly retreat from life in order to escape suffering. Maybe live your life, as in find something you want to do, dumbass? Instead of complaining all day on wizchan /dep/…Or maybe you are one of those persons who enjoy being miserable. In which case be my guest, go ahead and enjoy your self-torture. We need miserable people too in this world. There is really no wrong way to live your life, in the end. If you enjoy bitching here all day, then continue doing it and ignore what I write.
Anhedonia doesn't just suddenly appear. It has reasons, and the reasons are mostly because the person in question can't find a meaning or a coherent worldview. It is a sign that something is wrong, your body/mind is literally giving warning sounds yet you don't change anything. Hmm. People here are mostly secret masochists, been saying this for a long time but now I'm starting to be more sure of it. Another contradiction of pessimism, the pessimist wants to avoid suffering at all cost yet ends up walking right into it.
>We suffer because we are being punished for our fallen nature
Only in your retarded fairy tales. Humanity doesn't have a fallen nature, if anything we continue to march forward. This is a rotten mindset too, there is nothing wrong with human nature. We fulfill our purpose as a species very well. There is no original sin, or if there is it should be called the original virtue. Living in an idealistic world where nothing happens would be boring to infinite degree. Sin is what makes humanity interesting.
>happiness
It doesn't exist, it is an illusion for normals. The goal of life isn't happiness for me. It is to embrace my egoism and to live as an individual, even if it hurts me or others. If you closely observe others, nobody wants happiness really. People continue to make choices that bring them risk, pain, suffering and even death, and most of the time they even know the risks. It's as if humans were made to be at conflict with themselves and their peers as well.
>And no nihilism doesn't have several meanings, you just don't understand it which is embarrassing since it's a middle schooler's philosophy.
>Nihilism (/ˈnaɪ(h)ɪˌlɪzəm, ˈniː-/; from Latin nihil 'nothing', and English -ism) is a philosophy, or family of views within philosophy, that rejects general or fundamental aspects of human existence,[1][2] such as objective truth, knowledge, morality, values or meaning.[3][4] Different nihilist positions hold variously that human values are baseless, that life is meaningless, that knowledge is impossible, or that some set of entities do not exist or are meaningless or pointless.[5][6]
>Passive and active nihilism, the former of which is also equated to philosophical pessimism, refer to two approaches to nihilist thought; passive nihilism sees nihility as an end in itself, whereas active nihilism attempts to surpass it. For Nietzsche, passive nihilism further encapsulates the "will to nothing" and the modern condition of resignation or unawareness towards the dissolution of higher values brought about by the 19th century.[31][104]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism
Faggot.
He was right in that, pre-existentialism philosophy was nothing but cheap talk.
>>253163
God, do I have to spell everything out for you? Live your life, as in continue existing? You could start with that. Not like you will kill yourself anyway, we both know it. It is just empty roleplaying and masquerade. All talk and hypocrisy, this is what pessimism is. You don't want anything? Yeah sure Buddha, then why do you reply to my posts? Coult it be, gosh, you want to prove me wrong? O that can't be, after all you don't want anything in life. How could you want anything? Wanting anything is so healthy and it would actually give you a reason to do things, better pretend you don't want anything, you know, to fit in with the true wizards here. If you pretend you don't want anything, then nobody can hurt you, after all. This is the whole point of pessimism. A cowardly retreat from life in order to escape suffering. Maybe live your life, as in find something you want to do, dumbass? Instead of complaining all day on wizchan /dep/…Or maybe you are one of those persons who enjoy being miserable. In which case be my guest, go ahead and enjoy your self-torture. We need miserable people too in this world. There is really no wrong way to live your life, in the end. If you enjoy bitching here all day, then continue doing it and ignore what I write.
Anhedonia doesn't just suddenly appear. It has reasons, and the reasons are mostly because the person in question can't find a meaning or a coherent worldview. It is a sign that something is wrong, your body/mind is literally giving warning sounds yet you don't change anything. Hmm. People here are mostly secret masochists, been saying this for a long time but now I'm starting to be more sure of it. Another contradiction of pessimism, the pessimist wants to avoid suffering at all cost yet ends up walking right into it.
>We suffer because we are being punished for our fallen nature
Only in your retarded fairy tales. Humanity doesn't have a fallen nature, if anything we continue to march forward. This is a rotten mindset too, there is nothing wrong with human nature. We fulfill our purpose as a species very well. There is no original sin, or if there is it should be called the original virtue. Living in an idealistic world where nothing happens would be boring to infinite degree. Sin is what makes humanity interesting.
>happiness
It doesn't exist, it is an illusion for normals. The goal of life isn't happiness for me. It is to embrace my egoism and to live as an individual, even if it hurts me or others. If you closely observe others, nobody wants happiness really. People continue to make choices that bring them risk, pain, suffering and even death, and most of the time they even know the risks. It's as if humans were made to be at conflict with themselves and their peers as well.
>And no nihilism doesn't have several meanings, you just don't understand it which is embarrassing since it's a middle schooler's philosophy.
>Nihilism (/ˈnaɪ(h)ɪˌlɪzəm, ˈniː-/; from Latin nihil 'nothing', and English -ism) is a philosophy, or family of views within philosophy, that rejects general or fundamental aspects of human existence,[1][2] such as objective truth, knowledge, morality, values or meaning.[3][4] Different nihilist positions hold variously that human values are baseless, that life is meaningless, that knowledge is impossible, or that some set of entities do not exist or are meaningless or pointless.[5][6]
>Passive and active nihilism, the former of which is also equated to philosophical pessimism, refer to two approaches to nihilist thought; passive nihilism sees nihility as an end in itself, whereas active nihilism attempts to surpass it. For Nietzsche, passive nihilism further encapsulates the "will to nothing" and the modern condition of resignation or unawareness towards the dissolution of higher values brought about by the 19th century.[31][104]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism
Faggot.
>>249435
i still have books i want to read, movies i want to watch and games i want to play before i die.
sure, none of this will matter when i cease to live most likely but my guess is that i only have this life to do it and remember doing it.
so in essence the only thing that keeps me living is forgetting about life through fiction, nice.
i still have books i want to read, movies i want to watch and games i want to play before i die.
sure, none of this will matter when i cease to live most likely but my guess is that i only have this life to do it and remember doing it.
so in essence the only thing that keeps me living is forgetting about life through fiction, nice.
I am sorry for my english, I just want to respond.
>>253188
>the reasons are mostly because the person in question can't find a meaning or a coherent worldview
Anhedonia or depression can be a result of having no power i.e. having a low social status. When your social status is low, your body is going to torture you because it means that you have bad survival chances and the beast kinda wants you to survive. It also wants you to dominate over other men so feeling envious and resentful is only natural, as all men by nature are competitive.
I think that the lack of power is the reason why I'm depressed and I suspect that this is the case with some of the other people on this board. My worldview has nothing to do with how I feel, emotions are an indicator of one's power level. If i would win 1 million usd, I suspect that my body would instantly stop torturing me as my power level would increase, but maybe I am wrong.
>This is the whole point of pessimism
I think pessimism is more about appreciating the fact that life on earth is immoral and barbaric, while being utterly meaningless.
>Not like you will kill yourself anyway, we both know it
It's not easy to kill yourself because your body wants to survive sometimes even when you do not want to. There's a reason to think that the fear of death sometimes may outfight the mental or physical pain experienced. Some people would burn alive in a structure fire without jumping off their balconies to their death. There was that guy Leopardi who desperately wanted to kill himself in order to escape his miserable life, but was seemingly unable to overcome his self-preservation instinct.
I understand that people commit suicide all the time, but it's not clear to me that ALL people are capable of doing such an act when they want to. It just looks to me that some people are more impulsive than the other, probably due to the fact that their lifes are more random and richer in experience.
There is no exit door or a button to push that is going to put you to sleep instantly. There is no access to painless and guaranteed methods in most countries because suicide is prohibited and is a major taboo. Government would gladly take all the last methods available right now away if they could and society would gladly support it. As the world becomes more technically advanced, this possibility becomes more realistic.
This is the reason I think pessimism is more than justified. Personally I wouldn't complain so bitterly about life if I had an access to a cyanide pill, a gun or something else that will kill me instantly. I would just leave this place because I don't really like being here.
>>253005
>If it happened, it happens for a reason. Either to break you or to make you.
You're making it sound as if the function of suffering is to give you some kind of challenge just so you won't get bored to death; but many people are being born into this world only to suffer horribly and then to die shortly after. G: people in Africa, North Korea, whatever. Why is it "useful" for them to get broken without being provided even the smallest chance to avoid that?
The whole thing is a meatgrinder. You can't rationalize or justify it.
And considering the fact that people have no free will it's not really up to you whether you'll make it through the challenge or not, it's purely up to randomness.
I agree that suffering can be benefitial, but that's rather just a side effect, not the main purpose. The only reason nature gave us this ability is so that we could survive more efficiently and pass on our genes.
>>253007
Amazing.
>inb4: go away, crab/cretin
I will soon. You can ban me if you want.
>>253188
>the reasons are mostly because the person in question can't find a meaning or a coherent worldview
Anhedonia or depression can be a result of having no power i.e. having a low social status. When your social status is low, your body is going to torture you because it means that you have bad survival chances and the beast kinda wants you to survive. It also wants you to dominate over other men so feeling envious and resentful is only natural, as all men by nature are competitive.
I think that the lack of power is the reason why I'm depressed and I suspect that this is the case with some of the other people on this board. My worldview has nothing to do with how I feel, emotions are an indicator of one's power level. If i would win 1 million usd, I suspect that my body would instantly stop torturing me as my power level would increase, but maybe I am wrong.
>This is the whole point of pessimism
I think pessimism is more about appreciating the fact that life on earth is immoral and barbaric, while being utterly meaningless.
>Not like you will kill yourself anyway, we both know it
It's not easy to kill yourself because your body wants to survive sometimes even when you do not want to. There's a reason to think that the fear of death sometimes may outfight the mental or physical pain experienced. Some people would burn alive in a structure fire without jumping off their balconies to their death. There was that guy Leopardi who desperately wanted to kill himself in order to escape his miserable life, but was seemingly unable to overcome his self-preservation instinct.
I understand that people commit suicide all the time, but it's not clear to me that ALL people are capable of doing such an act when they want to. It just looks to me that some people are more impulsive than the other, probably due to the fact that their lifes are more random and richer in experience.
There is no exit door or a button to push that is going to put you to sleep instantly. There is no access to painless and guaranteed methods in most countries because suicide is prohibited and is a major taboo. Government would gladly take all the last methods available right now away if they could and society would gladly support it. As the world becomes more technically advanced, this possibility becomes more realistic.
This is the reason I think pessimism is more than justified. Personally I wouldn't complain so bitterly about life if I had an access to a cyanide pill, a gun or something else that will kill me instantly. I would just leave this place because I don't really like being here.
>>253005
>If it happened, it happens for a reason. Either to break you or to make you.
You're making it sound as if the function of suffering is to give you some kind of challenge just so you won't get bored to death; but many people are being born into this world only to suffer horribly and then to die shortly after. G: people in Africa, North Korea, whatever. Why is it "useful" for them to get broken without being provided even the smallest chance to avoid that?
The whole thing is a meatgrinder. You can't rationalize or justify it.
And considering the fact that people have no free will it's not really up to you whether you'll make it through the challenge or not, it's purely up to randomness.
I agree that suffering can be benefitial, but that's rather just a side effect, not the main purpose. The only reason nature gave us this ability is so that we could survive more efficiently and pass on our genes.
>>253007
Amazing.
>inb4: go away, crab/cretin
I will soon. You can ban me if you want.
>>253270
Your English is good, interesting and morbid post. Are you Italian (you mean Giacomo Leopardi?
One question I have is have you considered that even ina purely physical, chaotic and random universe with no god, there is no guarantee you will not exist again? For example, the Universe created all of this once, spitting out us and our parents all the way back to an infinite causal chain which operates without our control. Who is to say it could not happen aga8n?
Your English is good, interesting and morbid post. Are you Italian (you mean Giacomo Leopardi?
One question I have is have you considered that even ina purely physical, chaotic and random universe with no god, there is no guarantee you will not exist again? For example, the Universe created all of this once, spitting out us and our parents all the way back to an infinite causal chain which operates without our control. Who is to say it could not happen aga8n?
waiting for conditions to get worse first. they're livable right now.
the bad times outweigh the good times, but there's no rush. i'll die anyway whether i want to or not.
for now im first enjoying my time here with animals, the internet, movies and sometimes video games.
i also have a big writing project i want to complete before i die.
i don't even intend to share it with anybody anymore, i don't want to be publicized and be immortalized here or anything like that. i used to, but i don't care anymore.
no im just doing it for me, i just want to see my grand ideas transcribed and see how it looks. it's always different in your head than how it looks in paper and really works your logic to its maximum. my imagination has no rules, the paper forces me to implement rules.
it's interesting i guess, that's all.
the bad times outweigh the good times, but there's no rush. i'll die anyway whether i want to or not.
for now im first enjoying my time here with animals, the internet, movies and sometimes video games.
i also have a big writing project i want to complete before i die.
i don't even intend to share it with anybody anymore, i don't want to be publicized and be immortalized here or anything like that. i used to, but i don't care anymore.
no im just doing it for me, i just want to see my grand ideas transcribed and see how it looks. it's always different in your head than how it looks in paper and really works your logic to its maximum. my imagination has no rules, the paper forces me to implement rules.
it's interesting i guess, that's all.
>>249449
your story sounds staggeringly similar to a post I saw here years ago, except instead of someone he never met it was his only friend in the world. He too stuck around to see if it gets better and he too found that he didn't. Though this person made an addition, which was the fact that his friend's death was mourned as a tragedy, someone taken too soon. The person somewhat lamented the fact that he missed his chance to be a tragedy as well, instead of a relief.
your story sounds staggeringly similar to a post I saw here years ago, except instead of someone he never met it was his only friend in the world. He too stuck around to see if it gets better and he too found that he didn't. Though this person made an addition, which was the fact that his friend's death was mourned as a tragedy, someone taken too soon. The person somewhat lamented the fact that he missed his chance to be a tragedy as well, instead of a relief.
>>253285
Not him but I vaguely remember the post, too. His friend was about 20 or so and he caught the bus while wiz stuck around for another decade.
Not him but I vaguely remember the post, too. His friend was about 20 or so and he caught the bus while wiz stuck around for another decade.
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>>253282
>Are you Italian
I'm russian, thanks.
>you mean Giacomo Leopardi?
Yes. I refer to this picrel quote.
>For example, the Universe created all of this once, spitting out us and our parents all the way back to an infinite causal chain which operates without our control. Who is to say it could not happen aga8n?
I like to believe that with my death my consciousness is also going to disappear. If the next me is not going to have any memories about his previous life, then it's not going to be me I think. I don't really understand why should I care whether an identical copy of myself will be created. I mean, I'm sorry for this person, but there's not much I can do about his reappearance and it's not like I'm forcing this to happen by commiting suicide and preventing it by continuing living.
>Are you Italian
I'm russian, thanks.
>you mean Giacomo Leopardi?
Yes. I refer to this picrel quote.
>For example, the Universe created all of this once, spitting out us and our parents all the way back to an infinite causal chain which operates without our control. Who is to say it could not happen aga8n?
I like to believe that with my death my consciousness is also going to disappear. If the next me is not going to have any memories about his previous life, then it's not going to be me I think. I don't really understand why should I care whether an identical copy of myself will be created. I mean, I'm sorry for this person, but there's not much I can do about his reappearance and it's not like I'm forcing this to happen by commiting suicide and preventing it by continuing living.
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>>253270
>no power
So let's say you are depressed or have have anhedonia because you are weak, what did you do in order to achieve more power for yourself? Did you make any effort to solve your problem? Posting on /dep/ isn't the way to will yourself to power, you know. But then again, there are many rich people who are depressed or have fucked up lives, so I don't think this is only about money or power. While on the contrary lots of people who have low status relatively enjoy life. No, this goes deeper.
>My worldview has nothing to do with how I feel
Really? You are what you consume. If you read stuff written by so called pessimists all day (who in reality weren't actually pessimists at all, as it is just a farce most of the time) then don't be surprised that you will end up depressed. Or even if you hang around here most of your time. Do you think reading negative thoughts or losers whining all day will improve your mood or even won't have any effect on it? You'd be surprised how easily humans are influenced by their environment.
>life on earth is immoral and barbaric, while being utterly meaningless
Do you have any better alternative? No, killing yourself isn't a solution as you wouldn't benefit from it. Besides, sounds like you approach life with idealistic expectations. Of course you will always be disappointed if you compare real life with anime or what you see in movies. Is life immoral? Yes. Is it barbaric? For lots of people at least. Is it worth living? It is, despite all its faults.
And "meaningless" pff. What a laugh. If anything there are too many meanings you can choose from or if you don't like any you can make up your own. If life had an objective meaning, then people here would be bitching about that instead.
>all these excuses about why you are still alive
Funny. If someone genuinely has the desire to die, then he at least tries. Did you ever have serious suicide attempts? I did, when I wanted to die. You literally have no excuse for being alive, if you seriously wanted to die. But alas, most people here don't want to die really, they just like to complain and whine. All people are capable of suicide, if they really want to. It is just a matter of effort. You are quite pathetic at trying to present us with excuses. "If I had access to X I would do it" no, you wouldn't. You could easily throw yourself in front of a train or bus at any time, in any country or you could jump off a bridge or a great building, or just go outside into the cold and lie down with some alcohol. Admit it, you don't want to die. Stop being a pretentious faggot. It won't earn you anything. People who hate life actively try to do something about it. As things stand, you and most people here are just attention-whoring. No, you don't do it on reddit or social media because you don't like normals, but you do it on a fringe site, you just want comforting words and attention deep down.
>many people are being born into this world only to suffer horribly and then to die shortly after. G: people in Africa, North Korea, whatever. Why is it "useful" for them to get broken without being provided even the smallest chance to avoid that?
Haha, the Africa argument, I love it every time. Never gets old. Most importantly, you should understand wiz that it is not them who need help first of all, but you and people like you. Most people in NK and Africa don't kill themselves. There are always weak people in every culture and environment who don't want to struggle and exit. The people who suffer in the world, that's just their own fate. Everyone has to live out his fate. If your fate is to suffer, just suffer. We need miserable people like that too. Or don't you think we can appreciate our own life better after taking a look at how those people live? Some people were fated to represent misery and horrors to others. But let me tell you also this: nobody's life is pure 100% suffering. If there was even one moment of enjoyment in it, then it was worth being born.
Yeah, life is a meatgrinder. And so much more than that too. I don't want to justify it, because life is unfair, never said it was just. And for rationality, it seems pretty rational to me. Those who were fated to die, die early and those who were fated to survive, survive for a longer amount of time than others.
>randomness
No such thing. Everything is determined already. There is no coincidence or luck. There is a system of cause and effect and if you were fated to survive and to live a "happy" life (whatever it means) then you will do so. If you were fated to be weak and to suffer, then you won't escape your fate either. Accept your fate with dignity and live your life.
>The only reason nature gave us this ability is so that we could survive more efficiently and pass on our genes.
I wonder about that. I don't want to pass on my genes yet I very much want to survive and to enjoy what life has to offer. I don't have any interest in passing on my genes, I think it's a waste of time, for me at least. My reason for existence is to live as an individual, to be true to myself. I think by engaging in sex or reproduction people lose their individuality, what separates them from others and they become part of a collective. Sex and death - they are the same, a dark void of collective that I want to avoid as much possible. I want to exist on my own, as a different part from the collective.
>no power
So let's say you are depressed or have have anhedonia because you are weak, what did you do in order to achieve more power for yourself? Did you make any effort to solve your problem? Posting on /dep/ isn't the way to will yourself to power, you know. But then again, there are many rich people who are depressed or have fucked up lives, so I don't think this is only about money or power. While on the contrary lots of people who have low status relatively enjoy life. No, this goes deeper.
>My worldview has nothing to do with how I feel
Really? You are what you consume. If you read stuff written by so called pessimists all day (who in reality weren't actually pessimists at all, as it is just a farce most of the time) then don't be surprised that you will end up depressed. Or even if you hang around here most of your time. Do you think reading negative thoughts or losers whining all day will improve your mood or even won't have any effect on it? You'd be surprised how easily humans are influenced by their environment.
>life on earth is immoral and barbaric, while being utterly meaningless
Do you have any better alternative? No, killing yourself isn't a solution as you wouldn't benefit from it. Besides, sounds like you approach life with idealistic expectations. Of course you will always be disappointed if you compare real life with anime or what you see in movies. Is life immoral? Yes. Is it barbaric? For lots of people at least. Is it worth living? It is, despite all its faults.
And "meaningless" pff. What a laugh. If anything there are too many meanings you can choose from or if you don't like any you can make up your own. If life had an objective meaning, then people here would be bitching about that instead.
>all these excuses about why you are still alive
Funny. If someone genuinely has the desire to die, then he at least tries. Did you ever have serious suicide attempts? I did, when I wanted to die. You literally have no excuse for being alive, if you seriously wanted to die. But alas, most people here don't want to die really, they just like to complain and whine. All people are capable of suicide, if they really want to. It is just a matter of effort. You are quite pathetic at trying to present us with excuses. "If I had access to X I would do it" no, you wouldn't. You could easily throw yourself in front of a train or bus at any time, in any country or you could jump off a bridge or a great building, or just go outside into the cold and lie down with some alcohol. Admit it, you don't want to die. Stop being a pretentious faggot. It won't earn you anything. People who hate life actively try to do something about it. As things stand, you and most people here are just attention-whoring. No, you don't do it on reddit or social media because you don't like normals, but you do it on a fringe site, you just want comforting words and attention deep down.
>many people are being born into this world only to suffer horribly and then to die shortly after. G: people in Africa, North Korea, whatever. Why is it "useful" for them to get broken without being provided even the smallest chance to avoid that?
Haha, the Africa argument, I love it every time. Never gets old. Most importantly, you should understand wiz that it is not them who need help first of all, but you and people like you. Most people in NK and Africa don't kill themselves. There are always weak people in every culture and environment who don't want to struggle and exit. The people who suffer in the world, that's just their own fate. Everyone has to live out his fate. If your fate is to suffer, just suffer. We need miserable people like that too. Or don't you think we can appreciate our own life better after taking a look at how those people live? Some people were fated to represent misery and horrors to others. But let me tell you also this: nobody's life is pure 100% suffering. If there was even one moment of enjoyment in it, then it was worth being born.
Yeah, life is a meatgrinder. And so much more than that too. I don't want to justify it, because life is unfair, never said it was just. And for rationality, it seems pretty rational to me. Those who were fated to die, die early and those who were fated to survive, survive for a longer amount of time than others.
>randomness
No such thing. Everything is determined already. There is no coincidence or luck. There is a system of cause and effect and if you were fated to survive and to live a "happy" life (whatever it means) then you will do so. If you were fated to be weak and to suffer, then you won't escape your fate either. Accept your fate with dignity and live your life.
>The only reason nature gave us this ability is so that we could survive more efficiently and pass on our genes.
I wonder about that. I don't want to pass on my genes yet I very much want to survive and to enjoy what life has to offer. I don't have any interest in passing on my genes, I think it's a waste of time, for me at least. My reason for existence is to live as an individual, to be true to myself. I think by engaging in sex or reproduction people lose their individuality, what separates them from others and they become part of a collective. Sex and death - they are the same, a dark void of collective that I want to avoid as much possible. I want to exist on my own, as a different part from the collective.
>>253290
Interesting, thanks for the quote. I knew Leopardi was personally anguished (obviously by content of his work but also due to hunchback deformity, etc) but didn't know he was personally suicidal.
>If the next me is not going to have any memories about his previous life, then it's not going to be me I think
I like to think so too, but the problem here is you need to find a physical, material carrier of your identity - what makes "you" and "I" you and I, as in separate and distinguishable from the rest of the universe. If I was religious I would say that substance is a non material, eternal soul, created and owned by God, and this is what ensures my consciousness comes to an end when I die.
But without non material source, I think there is no way find a source of persistent identity. No one is actually, at bottom, their brain and body. The inquiry into selfhood cannot end there. My genes can change, my brain is replaced atom by atom throughout my life like the rest of my body, my physical self freely interacts with the rest of the world without a clear barrier - skin is permeable, of course I am breathing shared air, etc…when I sleep I exist but I have no awareness of it if I don't dream, yet when I wake up it seems seamless and that no time has passed, all while I remain to myself the same consciousness despite these re-arrangements.
There is a lot of doubt if you follow this line of thinking…that is what gets me. Thinking deeply about who "I" am leads me to conclude it must be purely physical, IE consciousness arises from material conditions, yet it cannot be anything that ceases to exist when my body and brain are destroyed.
Interesting, thanks for the quote. I knew Leopardi was personally anguished (obviously by content of his work but also due to hunchback deformity, etc) but didn't know he was personally suicidal.
>If the next me is not going to have any memories about his previous life, then it's not going to be me I think
I like to think so too, but the problem here is you need to find a physical, material carrier of your identity - what makes "you" and "I" you and I, as in separate and distinguishable from the rest of the universe. If I was religious I would say that substance is a non material, eternal soul, created and owned by God, and this is what ensures my consciousness comes to an end when I die.
But without non material source, I think there is no way find a source of persistent identity. No one is actually, at bottom, their brain and body. The inquiry into selfhood cannot end there. My genes can change, my brain is replaced atom by atom throughout my life like the rest of my body, my physical self freely interacts with the rest of the world without a clear barrier - skin is permeable, of course I am breathing shared air, etc…when I sleep I exist but I have no awareness of it if I don't dream, yet when I wake up it seems seamless and that no time has passed, all while I remain to myself the same consciousness despite these re-arrangements.
There is a lot of doubt if you follow this line of thinking…that is what gets me. Thinking deeply about who "I" am leads me to conclude it must be purely physical, IE consciousness arises from material conditions, yet it cannot be anything that ceases to exist when my body and brain are destroyed.
>>253297
Why must consciousness have a physical retainer? Or a barrier between the self and the not self? Consciousness is facilitated by your whole body. Every nerve ending adds information that forms your mental state. Consciousness is like a flame. It is the active process of being aware. When the reactions that facilitate it end, so does it. But it is not these reactions. When you strike a match, you see the flame and call it fire. But the fire isn’t really there. The wood is burning, but that isn’t flame. Gases are being released but that isn’t flame either. However the burning of the match causes flame. You cannot have flame without burning, but you can burn without flame.
Why must consciousness have a physical retainer? Or a barrier between the self and the not self? Consciousness is facilitated by your whole body. Every nerve ending adds information that forms your mental state. Consciousness is like a flame. It is the active process of being aware. When the reactions that facilitate it end, so does it. But it is not these reactions. When you strike a match, you see the flame and call it fire. But the fire isn’t really there. The wood is burning, but that isn’t flame. Gases are being released but that isn’t flame either. However the burning of the match causes flame. You cannot have flame without burning, but you can burn without flame.
I don't have the means to go for it, waiting for the perfect time where no one will know what happened, only that I disappeared
Elavil collecting starts today. This won't take long, cimetidine is easy to get. Valium is the issue.
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Let's cut right past all the pathetic ego-driven babbling of any life-apologists (always unsightly). It's fear of course. All motivation comes from harm-avoidance. All harm-avoidance is sub-consciously figured out through irrational hard-wired means. Fear is one of these means.
No one desires more of life, no one has agency when choosing life.
In a sense we're all suicidal inherently, but only because suicide is the simplest answer to the question of avoiding harm. It's a fact that life currently can't continue without harm. But the door to suicide is also laced with harm. To our primitive biological logics, that path is not as good as a warm bed, and a good meal. And so here we stay for several decades, all because we are incapable of initiating death using our own motivation. It's the path of least resistance. The road most-travelled. The easy option. The coward's way. Zero pro-activity. All procrastination. All excuses. All rationalizations. Drop a brick from the sky whenever someone thinks they'd rather not deal with something and we'd all be long gone.
The ramblings of the poor hurt self-images goes on long and harshly when accused of just being scared. It's actually because this, or that or this or that. But they can't prove a single ounce of agency to themselves. Scared addicts with personality complexes.
No one desires more of life, no one has agency when choosing life.
In a sense we're all suicidal inherently, but only because suicide is the simplest answer to the question of avoiding harm. It's a fact that life currently can't continue without harm. But the door to suicide is also laced with harm. To our primitive biological logics, that path is not as good as a warm bed, and a good meal. And so here we stay for several decades, all because we are incapable of initiating death using our own motivation. It's the path of least resistance. The road most-travelled. The easy option. The coward's way. Zero pro-activity. All procrastination. All excuses. All rationalizations. Drop a brick from the sky whenever someone thinks they'd rather not deal with something and we'd all be long gone.
The ramblings of the poor hurt self-images goes on long and harshly when accused of just being scared. It's actually because this, or that or this or that. But they can't prove a single ounce of agency to themselves. Scared addicts with personality complexes.
I'm too attached to everything with this constant unease. I hate the sickness and love my life in an infantile pursuit of pleasure. I know no different. I thought I could fix everything with a beer and a blunt. It crashes down eventually, so I may as well wait out the inevitable. I hate to think - that I can't get on without the medicine and that and I cannot. It haunts me how near I get. It hurts so god damn much during the day. I'm thirsty and sick. Sad and not all there. Anything but the inevitable. In need of medicine that prevents my ultimate displeasure.. I have formed this sick want that will not let me part from this disease addled body. I feel I must hold on. I will. Until nature rips me from this body with a splifg in my hand.
>>253294
Does it matter though?
His arguments seem consistent at least.
Personally I can't claim to really want to die either, but I haven't managed to improve my life either.
Does it matter though?
His arguments seem consistent at least.
Personally I can't claim to really want to die either, but I haven't managed to improve my life either.
Man struggles onward. No matter the weight that bears upon him, he must shoulder it and carry it with him, for that is what it means to live. When the time comes that I am called to leave this coil I shall hold my burdens and boons in equal measure of love for they go hand in hand as reflections of each other and are what made me uniquely Me.
2 months until I get relative freedom from where I'm located and able to purchase a firearm, collecting Elavil takes way too long and blowing my brains out in an isolated spot at an unlikely hour will actually do the trick
I haven't killsed myself because I'm still looking for a fast and painless way of doing it.
It needs to be fast because I don't want to be scared or regret it as I'm doing it and it needs to be painless for obvious reasons.
I'm also extremely scared of failing and becoming some amputee
It needs to be fast because I don't want to be scared or regret it as I'm doing it and it needs to be painless for obvious reasons.
I'm also extremely scared of failing and becoming some amputee
The mental gymnastics in this thread are hilarious. There will never be an ideal time, or an ideal method. Suicide is going to be difficult and it’s not going to be pleasant. You might as well just admit to yourself that you don’t really want to die and start living your life. You’re wasting so much time and pain on this illusion. Please wake up. Come back to reality.
>>249439
You said it perfectly. My life is boring and dull but I'm not in agonizing pain. We have forever to be dead so what's the point of rushing to it?
You said it perfectly. My life is boring and dull but I'm not in agonizing pain. We have forever to be dead so what's the point of rushing to it?
I am a giant pussy and can't harm myself in a serious way. I've tried a couple of times, failed miserably. Also afraid I will botch it like everything I try to do and become a vegetable which will make my life even more torturous than it already is.
>>252926
>heroin overdose
I have overdosed on heroin. I survived obviously, but its not as pleasant as you might think. It's not like the normal "nodding" state, where your mind wanders and you get the pipe dreams - you know that you fucked up, and that there is nothing you can do. Its terrifying. I imagine jumping from a bridge gives you the same feeling, the awful drop that lasts just long enough to regret what you've done.
Honestly I think shooting yourself is the best choice, because it is so fast, and you remain in control until the last second
>heroin overdose
I have overdosed on heroin. I survived obviously, but its not as pleasant as you might think. It's not like the normal "nodding" state, where your mind wanders and you get the pipe dreams - you know that you fucked up, and that there is nothing you can do. Its terrifying. I imagine jumping from a bridge gives you the same feeling, the awful drop that lasts just long enough to regret what you've done.
Honestly I think shooting yourself is the best choice, because it is so fast, and you remain in control until the last second
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>>256009
VR is already looking really good. It's a great tech for Wizards that are not ready to take the emergency exit.
VR is already looking really good. It's a great tech for Wizards that are not ready to take the emergency exit.
>>253161
stopped reading at beliving in an afterlife. thats a huge cope. there is nothing after death
stopped reading at beliving in an afterlife. thats a huge cope. there is nothing after death
>>256009
I hate this picture probably some fucking normalfag who decided to copy that vr gondola picture.
I hate this picture probably some fucking normalfag who decided to copy that vr gondola picture.
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>>256050
sorry, here' the original
sorry, here' the original
>>256033
Believing that death is the end is the biggest cope, as it frees you from judgement for your life on earth. If you lived in fear of God you will be a better person
Believing that death is the end is the biggest cope, as it frees you from judgement for your life on earth. If you lived in fear of God you will be a better person
>>256053
that's right
"after death is nothingness" copers cannot explain how subjective experience can arise from no subjective experience
hint: it cannot and it's plainly obvious so. if you dream without sleep, if you go into a coma or under anesthesia, your awareness simply jumps to the next instance in the universe such that sufficient material complexity (the brain is working well enough) permits consciousness
the idea of continued consciousness without memory is maddening
that's right
"after death is nothingness" copers cannot explain how subjective experience can arise from no subjective experience
hint: it cannot and it's plainly obvious so. if you dream without sleep, if you go into a coma or under anesthesia, your awareness simply jumps to the next instance in the universe such that sufficient material complexity (the brain is working well enough) permits consciousness
the idea of continued consciousness without memory is maddening
>>256055
>>256053
From the time you are born your brain is using energy to maintain a continuous electrical signal that manifests your existence, when this power turns off you are gone, like with any chemical reaction. This electricity in your brain has no more higher existence than a flame that burns itself out. Though I do find this a bit interesting, the idea that we may be wholly an electrical pattern and not flesh (it does make me think a bit of a work of divinity), and again the same as a fire isn't the kindling (but is fire divine?). But I don't think the nature of things would allow such order as a brain pattern to exist in our chaotic universe without the structure of the brain or something similar. Rather your lost consciousness only contributes to an encroaching void of nothingness e.g. the end of the universe.
>>256053
From the time you are born your brain is using energy to maintain a continuous electrical signal that manifests your existence, when this power turns off you are gone, like with any chemical reaction. This electricity in your brain has no more higher existence than a flame that burns itself out. Though I do find this a bit interesting, the idea that we may be wholly an electrical pattern and not flesh (it does make me think a bit of a work of divinity), and again the same as a fire isn't the kindling (but is fire divine?). But I don't think the nature of things would allow such order as a brain pattern to exist in our chaotic universe without the structure of the brain or something similar. Rather your lost consciousness only contributes to an encroaching void of nothingness e.g. the end of the universe.
>>249435
More of a "i should kill myself" situation instead of a "i will kill myself" situation. Who knows, maybe i will if things get worse? For now it's just being sedated with food and shelter and wishing i was dead.
More of a "i should kill myself" situation instead of a "i will kill myself" situation. Who knows, maybe i will if things get worse? For now it's just being sedated with food and shelter and wishing i was dead.
>>256055
I don't know if that's correct but it really is hard to reconcile the hard problem of consciousness. I don't really think anyone has a satisfying enough answer yet.
I don't know if that's correct but it really is hard to reconcile the hard problem of consciousness. I don't really think anyone has a satisfying enough answer yet.
It's all the things I look forward to and all the hopes that come true. It's worth mentioning - that every once in a blue moon, I sit in awe of all that has been bestowed. And in my darkest hour I remember all that is possible - and that it's only those things are being taken. And I can't stand to part from those joys. You begin to strip the good out of my life though, taking until the ends and the items are gone, and all of a sudden, my will to live disappears. It just turns off like a switch. I guess that means I'm a material person.
As silly as it sounds, I'm waiting for a few anime to be released. There are some interesting looking shows sitting on my backlog, too.
>>258622
I'm so burnt out on media now but it's nice when you find something you can actually enjoy. New Mob and Chainsawman should be fun.
I'm so burnt out on media now but it's nice when you find something you can actually enjoy. New Mob and Chainsawman should be fun.
I bought rope but i'm too retarded to tie a noose properly and it seems like a pretty bad way to bow out. Falling from a great height could be nice. I dunno, give it a few more years and see how i feel i guess.
>>258658
I don’t get where people even hang themselves from. I doubt a modern fan would support a person and I don’t have exposed rafters, and the same goes for most people.
I don’t get where people even hang themselves from. I doubt a modern fan would support a person and I don’t have exposed rafters, and the same goes for most people.
>>258660
As long as you're not a wiz that minds leaving the house once in a while then trees would suffice.
As long as you're not a wiz that minds leaving the house once in a while then trees would suffice.
You guys ever wonder what kind of people will come to your funeral? I don't want some retards from school to come and attend my funeral…
It would be so fucking wrong? and cringe idk
It would be so fucking wrong? and cringe idk
>>258663
This is probably a lot of my own negative projections but funerals make me wince in general and i've been to a few over the years with my parents and their friends getting older. Some guy standing up in front of a bunch of people embellishing stories and personality traits about someone he never met while the audience collectively buy into it and tell themselves "that was so him/her". The majority of the people there will stop thinking about the deceased after a week (if that). Thinking about a priest or whatever trying to put a positive spin on the life i didn't lead while the few attendants that show up lie to themselves about what a loss they've had makes me glad i wont be around to see it. To quote Frank Reynolds "Just throw me out with the trash".
This is probably a lot of my own negative projections but funerals make me wince in general and i've been to a few over the years with my parents and their friends getting older. Some guy standing up in front of a bunch of people embellishing stories and personality traits about someone he never met while the audience collectively buy into it and tell themselves "that was so him/her". The majority of the people there will stop thinking about the deceased after a week (if that). Thinking about a priest or whatever trying to put a positive spin on the life i didn't lead while the few attendants that show up lie to themselves about what a loss they've had makes me glad i wont be around to see it. To quote Frank Reynolds "Just throw me out with the trash".
I just don't have the balls to do it
but today it hit me I probably have 50 years or more ahead
50 fucking more years of misery and social isolation
I can't handle it
Tomorrow I will start smoking as to shorten my life expectancy
I will also up my alcohol intake and switch all my healthy foods for junk
Any other ideas for a 'slow suicide'?
but today it hit me I probably have 50 years or more ahead
50 fucking more years of misery and social isolation
I can't handle it
Tomorrow I will start smoking as to shorten my life expectancy
I will also up my alcohol intake and switch all my healthy foods for junk
Any other ideas for a 'slow suicide'?
>>258665
All those people at my funeral will think of me for those few short moments and then forget about me forever. I started out as nothing, lived as nothing, and then ended my life as nothing.
All those people at my funeral will think of me for those few short moments and then forget about me forever. I started out as nothing, lived as nothing, and then ended my life as nothing.
>>249955
I don't know about you, but sometimes I even start to believe things will get better. Then I give it a day or two and I realize just how bad my life is going to get.
I don't know about you, but sometimes I even start to believe things will get better. Then I give it a day or two and I realize just how bad my life is going to get.
The only thing that keeps me going is the hope I'll have my own place and a dog one day. Animals are the only thing on the planet that don't make me feel like shit.
>>258673
like 99% of people in existence. either way whether people remember your existence doesn't matter, that's one of the points of death, nothing will matters in the end, especially for the one who's in the main perspective.
like 99% of people in existence. either way whether people remember your existence doesn't matter, that's one of the points of death, nothing will matters in the end, especially for the one who's in the main perspective.
>>260552
isnt that a meme? (do you mean holotropic,tho?)
What are some other ways to "trip without drugs",if you know any? It seems looking at one's own reflection in the mirror for 30 minutes or more,triggers trippy shit.
isnt that a meme? (do you mean holotropic,tho?)
What are some other ways to "trip without drugs",if you know any? It seems looking at one's own reflection in the mirror for 30 minutes or more,triggers trippy shit.
>>249436
>the real hold up is being a pussy and ruminating over life being far far worse dead than alive
Life's not anything when you're dead, life does not exist when you are dead.
>the real hold up is being a pussy and ruminating over life being far far worse dead than alive
Life's not anything when you're dead, life does not exist when you are dead.
>>260583
theres no point in trying to "release" whatever pain you are in because in the unlikely scenario that there is nothingness after death, you couldnt possibly experience it.
likely youll just be sprung into another miserable existence in some form that wont improve your situation
theres no point in trying to "release" whatever pain you are in because in the unlikely scenario that there is nothingness after death, you couldnt possibly experience it.
likely youll just be sprung into another miserable existence in some form that wont improve your situation
>>260590
>in the unlikely scenario that there is nothingness after death, you couldnt possibly experience it.
I mean, even speaking hypothetically, wouldn't that still be better? Like, the point of killing oneself to escape pain isn't to then experience bliss, but to not experience any pain in the first place, so the goal would still be reached.
>in the unlikely scenario that there is nothingness after death, you couldnt possibly experience it.
I mean, even speaking hypothetically, wouldn't that still be better? Like, the point of killing oneself to escape pain isn't to then experience bliss, but to not experience any pain in the first place, so the goal would still be reached.
>>258670
smoking is natural, actually. our oga-booga caveman ancestors,hunter-gatherers etc,grew up and developed surrounded by (fire)smoke. Also nicotine raises T.
just saying…
smoking is natural, actually. our oga-booga caveman ancestors,hunter-gatherers etc,grew up and developed surrounded by (fire)smoke. Also nicotine raises T.
just saying…
>>260621
This is true but you need to roll your own or smoke American spirits to avoid all the bad stuff (((they))) put in it
This is true but you need to roll your own or smoke American spirits to avoid all the bad stuff (((they))) put in it
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I havent offed myself yet because of a vestigial/residual fear of hell/christian morality,which says suicide is bad.
thats the main reason really, I hate atheism as a modern movement but I also dont want god to be real(this means he skrewed me up deliberately…)
im between a sword and a hard place
thats the main reason really, I hate atheism as a modern movement but I also dont want god to be real(this means he skrewed me up deliberately…)
im between a sword and a hard place
i dont want to kill myself because i still enjoy life
i just want to avoid people irl as much as i can
i just want to avoid people irl as much as i can
>>260624
do you know of any tobacco i can order online for low price? all the tobacco where i live is super expensive, like 10 bucks for a pack of cigarettes
do you know of any tobacco i can order online for low price? all the tobacco where i live is super expensive, like 10 bucks for a pack of cigarettes
>>260628
All those USA based buy tobacco online sites are scams. Might be different in Europe IDK but I doubt it.
All those USA based buy tobacco online sites are scams. Might be different in Europe IDK but I doubt it.
>>260598
there is no such thing as a loss of matter in the universe. only a reduction from one state to another. consciousness only exists when there is a means to observe the world. the same way you were sprung onto this world you'll be brought to another once more because life will always find a way to exist in some form. just a theory of mine
there is no such thing as a loss of matter in the universe. only a reduction from one state to another. consciousness only exists when there is a means to observe the world. the same way you were sprung onto this world you'll be brought to another once more because life will always find a way to exist in some form. just a theory of mine
>>249435
> Decide I'll check out via my (strong) painkillers
> Still need one or two meds
> Afraid of being paralyzed if I fail
It shouldn't be this hard.
> Decide I'll check out via my (strong) painkillers
> Still need one or two meds
> Afraid of being paralyzed if I fail
It shouldn't be this hard.
>>260638
Your concept of a reborn "you" isnt the same "you".
Your theory is nonsensical without dealing with the concept of self and individuality of consciousness. For example some sects of buddhism say we are all one interconnected self. The individual consciousness physically linked to a brain can be extinguished and there is no reason to think that particular observer has to be continuous.
Your concept of a reborn "you" isnt the same "you".
Your theory is nonsensical without dealing with the concept of self and individuality of consciousness. For example some sects of buddhism say we are all one interconnected self. The individual consciousness physically linked to a brain can be extinguished and there is no reason to think that particular observer has to be continuous.
>>249435
I am afraid that there might be afterlife and have no balls to commit act even if i really want to.
I am afraid that there might be afterlife and have no balls to commit act even if i really want to.
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I have pets who wouldn't have anyone to feed them if I'm gone.
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>>261021
They really do make coming home from a 10 hour shift worth it.
They shit everywhere but they're worth it.
They really do make coming home from a 10 hour shift worth it.
They shit everywhere but they're worth it.
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