File: 1688478145130.png (601.89 KB, 670x878, 335:439, 1687076147664621.png) ImgOps iqdb
Why isn't this philosophy discussed more here? Seeing as we're all celibate and have miserable lives it seems like a natural fit. Personally this is a religion for me, I wear a graphic T that says "birth is the beginning of damnation". Whenever someone asks me what that means, it gives me an opportunity to spread the bad news and use street epistemology to question them on whether they should have children. This philosophy has given me meaning and purpose despite what a black pill it is.
Life is a struggle for survival, it makes absolutely no sense to give birth to someone.
All the suffering could be avoided by preventing birth.
All the suffering could be avoided by preventing birth.
>>279193
I'm not saying they have to be activists like me but I am surprised antinatalism isn't discussed more. I have seen antinatalism mentioned about 3 or 4 times on here in total. It really surprises me there aren't more antinatalists here, lazy or not.
I'm not saying they have to be activists like me but I am surprised antinatalism isn't discussed more. I have seen antinatalism mentioned about 3 or 4 times on here in total. It really surprises me there aren't more antinatalists here, lazy or not.
>>279195
That would be like christians or existentialists not having anything to discuss. Its a whole ideology with philosophy and praxis.
That would be like christians or existentialists not having anything to discuss. Its a whole ideology with philosophy and praxis.
>>279195
there are people here who are very pro-natalist and think no kids = failed man
just like there are people here who shit on neets or homeless wizards
they are failed normals who dislike the fact that they have to come here to vent their self hatred
there are people here who are very pro-natalist and think no kids = failed man
just like there are people here who shit on neets or homeless wizards
they are failed normals who dislike the fact that they have to come here to vent their self hatred
There's nothing to discuss. It's like having a thread on if suffering is bad or not. Everyone knows it is, there is only the arbitrary self-justifications of what circumstances you are okay with hurting others in.
File: 1688491916048.jpeg (55.7 KB, 457x672, 457:672, images.jpeg) ImgOps iqdb
I guess it's the simple fact that not only was it never against the law to do what most people are going to do anyway, but the fact even succubi have regretted it later on in life.
In 2015 I read a comic called "Hopeless Savages" which summarized it all in a nutshell: "there is more to life than that".
And if that's too PG here's a less sugarcoated reason https://web.archive.org/web/20101028150231/http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/guest_contributors/article7009550.ece
In 2015 I read a comic called "Hopeless Savages" which summarized it all in a nutshell: "there is more to life than that".
And if that's too PG here's a less sugarcoated reason https://web.archive.org/web/20101028150231/http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/guest_contributors/article7009550.ece
>>279211
The natalist is the child who will get everyone in the village hooked on heroin because his life is kinda okay, I guess, idk.
The natalist is the child who will get everyone in the village hooked on heroin because his life is kinda okay, I guess, idk.
>>279196
Antinatalism doesn't really provide anything that means you consider it daily like existentialism, and it doesn't create any concept for your daily life in Christianity.
OP may find a moral drive to tell others to act morally in not having children, but to me, yeah it's probably a moral position but I don't really care enough to try and convince others.
For the person who has no inclination to change others, especially one who isn't experiencing external pressure from parents/spouse to have children, it doesn't really need to be discussed.
Antinatalism doesn't really provide anything that means you consider it daily like existentialism, and it doesn't create any concept for your daily life in Christianity.
OP may find a moral drive to tell others to act morally in not having children, but to me, yeah it's probably a moral position but I don't really care enough to try and convince others.
For the person who has no inclination to change others, especially one who isn't experiencing external pressure from parents/spouse to have children, it doesn't really need to be discussed.
Meanwhile you wizards are discussing natalism there are a lot of things going on of importance but you guys wont/dont know whats that because innane bullshit is more important to you
As others said, i'm not sure there's much to say about it.
And to be honest, even though it's true on an individual level, i'm not sure it's worth spreading on a societal level anyway. For example, one birth of a human prevents the births of many wildlife animals, right? (Though it may also cause other births elsewhere). It's not like I researched causal relationships like this in that much depth, but because of possibilities like that, i'm not completely sure it's worth spreading this ideology before something else.
And to be honest, even though it's true on an individual level, i'm not sure it's worth spreading on a societal level anyway. For example, one birth of a human prevents the births of many wildlife animals, right? (Though it may also cause other births elsewhere). It's not like I researched causal relationships like this in that much depth, but because of possibilities like that, i'm not completely sure it's worth spreading this ideology before something else.
>>279220
I'm not sure that most people have much effect on wildlife at all and they also generally generate a lot of demand for livestock, which generally live in much poorer conditions.
I'm not sure that most people have much effect on wildlife at all and they also generally generate a lot of demand for livestock, which generally live in much poorer conditions.
Philosophy of that nature is completely useless no matter how true it is. You cannot philosophize yourself out of depression. In fact, you say you have meaning from a depressing philosophy. You could just as easily read empowering philosophy like Schopenhauer (read past the surface level) and Nietzsche (read him for the rest of your life). Empowering not in the sense of the succubus who takes a warm-filtered selfie of herself with her Starbucks coffee after yoga class. Empowering in a deeply spiritual sense: strengthening and hardening your soul.
Truth doesn't matter. Only the effect of the philosophy matters. If the philosophy makes you dejected, you are a fool for wallowing in it. Once can feed himself books to make himself a fascist; that same man can just as easily feed himself books to make him a communist.
There are more things in heaven and earth, anon, than are dreamt of in your philosophy…
Truth doesn't matter. Only the effect of the philosophy matters. If the philosophy makes you dejected, you are a fool for wallowing in it. Once can feed himself books to make himself a fascist; that same man can just as easily feed himself books to make him a communist.
There are more things in heaven and earth, anon, than are dreamt of in your philosophy…
>>279246
That doesn't do anything to me. The point is you basically wasted your time arguing for something that refutes itself, that truth doesn't matter. Nobody who is intellectually honest should be convinced by your post.
That doesn't do anything to me. The point is you basically wasted your time arguing for something that refutes itself, that truth doesn't matter. Nobody who is intellectually honest should be convinced by your post.
>>279241
You could be right. I don't know much about the effects of individuals on this.
Since 1970, there has apparently been a 70% decrease in wildlife populations of mammals, birds, amphibians, reptiles and fish, and this has obviously been caused by humans. I just wanted to stress that humans are vital for decreasing the populations of other wildlife, and that this means it may not necessarily be a good idea in all cases for us to abstain from procreation. If it was taken to a global scale, it would definitely be catastrophic.
I don't think livestock live in worse conditions than wildlife does on average, I think they both have it pretty terribly. Is it better to be eaten alive in infancy, or to be confined in a factory for a few months and slaughtered? The wildlife deaths are probably more painful, but as a tradeoff, the livestock have to live confined.
Agriculture (Including factory farming) also plays a dramatic role in deforestation, which itself reduces wildlife populations significantly. It's ironic that an institution built on the suffering of livestock animals may be reducing the suffering of wildlife animals.
You could be right. I don't know much about the effects of individuals on this.
Since 1970, there has apparently been a 70% decrease in wildlife populations of mammals, birds, amphibians, reptiles and fish, and this has obviously been caused by humans. I just wanted to stress that humans are vital for decreasing the populations of other wildlife, and that this means it may not necessarily be a good idea in all cases for us to abstain from procreation. If it was taken to a global scale, it would definitely be catastrophic.
I don't think livestock live in worse conditions than wildlife does on average, I think they both have it pretty terribly. Is it better to be eaten alive in infancy, or to be confined in a factory for a few months and slaughtered? The wildlife deaths are probably more painful, but as a tradeoff, the livestock have to live confined.
Agriculture (Including factory farming) also plays a dramatic role in deforestation, which itself reduces wildlife populations significantly. It's ironic that an institution built on the suffering of livestock animals may be reducing the suffering of wildlife animals.
File: 1688535244182.png (407.18 KB, 537x474, 179:158, 1686973774895342.png) ImgOps iqdb
>>279248
Fuck the animals anyway. I am primarily an antinatalist because of the possibility of life after death attested to by things like NDE's.
Fuck the animals anyway. I am primarily an antinatalist because of the possibility of life after death attested to by things like NDE's.
>>279248
If other animals had our intelligence and abilities, they would of done the same thing anyways. It's just survival of the fittest and we came on top because of our evolved brains through millions of hardship and surviving. Now go preach your vegan bullshit somewhere else.
If other animals had our intelligence and abilities, they would of done the same thing anyways. It's just survival of the fittest and we came on top because of our evolved brains through millions of hardship and surviving. Now go preach your vegan bullshit somewhere else.
File: 1688540834053.jpg (431.29 KB, 2048x1793, 2048:1793, Furude.Rika.full.3128918.jpg) ImgOps iqdb
>>279251
You're an anthropocentric antinatalist? I see.
Since I am sentiocentric, our viewpoints are essentially incompatible. The two lead to such different conclusions that they may as well be different philosophies. I think it's helpful to make a sharp distinction between them.
You're an anthropocentric antinatalist? I see.
Since I am sentiocentric, our viewpoints are essentially incompatible. The two lead to such different conclusions that they may as well be different philosophies. I think it's helpful to make a sharp distinction between them.
When I realized that, like buddhists said, "desire is the root of suffering" but here desire is basically any activity that seeks to extend life as long as possible because fear of mortality is what imho drives every human action (and likely animals too), that's when I realized *life* not just human life, was a massive mistake.
>>279254
Realizing that life is about bringing others into a horrible existence to repeat the cycle until the end of time pretty much blackpilled me at this point.
Realizing that life is about bringing others into a horrible existence to repeat the cycle until the end of time pretty much blackpilled me at this point.
We are not the doer of our actions. People can't be faulted for having children it is a natural impetus. What happens if humans stop having children? We go extinct and than new intelligent life develops which suffers again, or more likely muslims inherit the world. I propose a heroic antinatalism where those who recognize life's badness recognize our ability to perhaps do something about it. It has a special emphasis on scientific research and "playing God". It is not worth giving up when humanity might be able to do something about it and stop it from happening again, we've nothing to lose. I forget the quote but it was by a Greek, it went something like "I cannot consider life bad because death exist' This makes sense to me because when we are dead it's like it never happened, everything that ever happened to me was like a dream, sometimes it was very sweet and exciting and I flourished and rejoiced in being alive often I suffered and cursed myself, but It never really happened.
I have seen myself as a fractal of God and I have stop blaming myself or my parents. I am part of something larger.
I don't think telling others about antinatalism does us any good and should be kept a secret. You might prevent a birth but you don't actually prevent any suffering whatsoever.
Also I don't think wild animals suffer all too much, we are projecting our human experience onto them, it is hubris. Are their lives just survival and breeding? yes, but I think they have joie de vivre and even in their final moments dying they are glad because their species lives on. Even though it will some day go extinct they don't know this.
I have seen myself as a fractal of God and I have stop blaming myself or my parents. I am part of something larger.
I don't think telling others about antinatalism does us any good and should be kept a secret. You might prevent a birth but you don't actually prevent any suffering whatsoever.
Also I don't think wild animals suffer all too much, we are projecting our human experience onto them, it is hubris. Are their lives just survival and breeding? yes, but I think they have joie de vivre and even in their final moments dying they are glad because their species lives on. Even though it will some day go extinct they don't know this.
>>279260
The only way I'm supporting natalism is through eugenics. Creating perfect bodies and perfect minds would make our stay in this Godforsaken world a little more pleasant. Of course death would still be a threat, but with science we can make our lives less misserable and maybe even live longer. But nothing like that will ever happen because humans are crabs in a bucket.
The only way I'm supporting natalism is through eugenics. Creating perfect bodies and perfect minds would make our stay in this Godforsaken world a little more pleasant. Of course death would still be a threat, but with science we can make our lives less misserable and maybe even live longer. But nothing like that will ever happen because humans are crabs in a bucket.
File: 1688569122975.png (41.64 KB, 900x674, 450:337, transparent png.png) ImgOps iqdb
>>279191
>Why isn't this philosophy discussed more here?
It was discussed here a lot last year, although personally it didn't reach the point of intervention
>Personally this is a religion for me, I wear a graphic T that says "birth is the beginning of damnation". Whenever someone asks me what that means, it gives me an opportunity to spread the bad news and use street epistemology to question them on whether they should have children.
Is this a thing? On an epistemic level a priest, rabbi, or imam might be fun to talk with for you
>Why isn't this philosophy discussed more here?
It was discussed here a lot last year, although personally it didn't reach the point of intervention
>Personally this is a religion for me, I wear a graphic T that says "birth is the beginning of damnation". Whenever someone asks me what that means, it gives me an opportunity to spread the bad news and use street epistemology to question them on whether they should have children.
Is this a thing? On an epistemic level a priest, rabbi, or imam might be fun to talk with for you
i see little point in anti-natalistic activism, the world will die at one point on its own, inevitably, with or without contribution
Human bodies are torture chambers, but soon I will create the cybertopia. We will put brains inside machines that keep them alive, and hook them upto computers so they can experience infinte entertainment. They will have oxygen, morphine, and more, all pumped through their brain to preserve their existance and wellbeing. They will live to be 32 years old or 64 years old, I don't know yet.
File: 1688580508774.png (562.83 KB, 900x675, 4:3, 1687163605997342.png) ImgOps iqdb
i find it hard to believe 200k normies on the subreddit actually believe the same antinatalism that we do tbh
they probably view it as abortion activism so they can have sex as much as they want without new life being birthed ngl
they probably view it as abortion activism so they can have sex as much as they want without new life being birthed ngl
File: 1688586045784.jpg (7.1 MB, 2600x2600, 1:1, Jirachi.full.3592767.jpg) ImgOps iqdb
>>279260
I think people can be faulted for having children. It's a natural impetus, yes, but clearly not an inevitable one given that this entire board is celibate. I guess if you meant it in a deterministic sense you're right, because in that way nobody is really accountable for anything. I wouldn't fault people for it anyway, though, because it doesn't lead anywhere productive.
The "heroic antinatalism" you propose is essentially just transhumanism or efilism, as you're probably aware. Those are the two solutions that have been mostly proposed before to solve the problem of suffering - Removing suffering in the world, either through technology (nanotechnology and genetic engineering ala the hedonistic imperative) or through absolute extinction (efilism ala inmendham). The problem with both solutions is that they're wildly impractical. Relying on technology is also something of a gamble, since technology could easily be used in the opposite manner to create unimaginable harms instead, which is why extinction is probably the most risk-averse option. But it would also be a massive problem if we attempted to annihilate life and failed to do so completely.
What the actual lived experience of the average wild animal is like is an interesting question. I think it is, compared to humans, much more visceral in every degree. The pleasures are probably more pronounced, and the pains are probably similarly more pronounced. The human senses actually seem to be quite subdued compared to many other animals, so we aren't the greatest comparison point. I don't think it would be accurate to say they live each day in some perpetual suffering, but i'm sure the deaths and harms themselves are extremely painful.
>even in their final moments dying they are glad because their species lives on
That's where I blatantly disagree. It seems odd for an unintelligent animal to have any concerns like that. Animals only care about the immediate sensations they're experiencing, the pleasures and pains of the moment. When they're starving to death or being eaten, they won't feel glad about "the species living on" or something. Those are the kinds of higher-order thoughts only humans have.
I think people can be faulted for having children. It's a natural impetus, yes, but clearly not an inevitable one given that this entire board is celibate. I guess if you meant it in a deterministic sense you're right, because in that way nobody is really accountable for anything. I wouldn't fault people for it anyway, though, because it doesn't lead anywhere productive.
The "heroic antinatalism" you propose is essentially just transhumanism or efilism, as you're probably aware. Those are the two solutions that have been mostly proposed before to solve the problem of suffering - Removing suffering in the world, either through technology (nanotechnology and genetic engineering ala the hedonistic imperative) or through absolute extinction (efilism ala inmendham). The problem with both solutions is that they're wildly impractical. Relying on technology is also something of a gamble, since technology could easily be used in the opposite manner to create unimaginable harms instead, which is why extinction is probably the most risk-averse option. But it would also be a massive problem if we attempted to annihilate life and failed to do so completely.
What the actual lived experience of the average wild animal is like is an interesting question. I think it is, compared to humans, much more visceral in every degree. The pleasures are probably more pronounced, and the pains are probably similarly more pronounced. The human senses actually seem to be quite subdued compared to many other animals, so we aren't the greatest comparison point. I don't think it would be accurate to say they live each day in some perpetual suffering, but i'm sure the deaths and harms themselves are extremely painful.
>even in their final moments dying they are glad because their species lives on
That's where I blatantly disagree. It seems odd for an unintelligent animal to have any concerns like that. Animals only care about the immediate sensations they're experiencing, the pleasures and pains of the moment. When they're starving to death or being eaten, they won't feel glad about "the species living on" or something. Those are the kinds of higher-order thoughts only humans have.
>>279275
Yeah, a lot of the users were so disatisfied with the childfree fags that just hate children and don't want to take responsibility for any, that they made an entirely new subreddit called r/antinatalism2. Normies basically can't be antinatalists because they huff so much copium that they can never see life in objective, pessimistic terms.
Yeah, a lot of the users were so disatisfied with the childfree fags that just hate children and don't want to take responsibility for any, that they made an entirely new subreddit called r/antinatalism2. Normies basically can't be antinatalists because they huff so much copium that they can never see life in objective, pessimistic terms.
>>279277
As far as the philosophical preoccupations go, I find the argument that genuine pleasure does not exist (its just varying degrees of inutility) and the consent argument way more compelling than asymmetry.
As far as the philosophical preoccupations go, I find the argument that genuine pleasure does not exist (its just varying degrees of inutility) and the consent argument way more compelling than asymmetry.
>>279275
It has substantially grown in the last few years. Old antinatalism used to be a bunch of people stuck on existential suffering issues, antinatalist writers, and depression, whereas the subreddit has morphed in to the new-internet culture of entertainment. When it turned to random screenshots of other reddit users or facebook parents and mocking them it grew fast.
More generally though it really doesn't take much to be drawn to antinatalism beyond experiences which take away the lust for life. One doesn't need to be an outcast or particularly non-normie, it can happen to anyone. You will find lots of users there with different focuses though. 200k is nothing in the scale of things
It has substantially grown in the last few years. Old antinatalism used to be a bunch of people stuck on existential suffering issues, antinatalist writers, and depression, whereas the subreddit has morphed in to the new-internet culture of entertainment. When it turned to random screenshots of other reddit users or facebook parents and mocking them it grew fast.
More generally though it really doesn't take much to be drawn to antinatalism beyond experiences which take away the lust for life. One doesn't need to be an outcast or particularly non-normie, it can happen to anyone. You will find lots of users there with different focuses though. 200k is nothing in the scale of things
File: 1688613467108.png (37.34 KB, 380x178, 190:89, mm.png) ImgOps iqdb
>>279275
There are several corruptions of the functional neutral antinatalism.
The most common is the environmentalist angle, they care only because they believe less people may shape an environment more comfortable for themselves within their lifetime. Then less common is those that do it out of hate, they simply want some form of retaliation against life but lack the violence in their heart to do more than yell at others to not have kids. Lastly, though adjacent to the environmentalists, there is the utilitarians that believe they can achieve some perfect society through selective culling. The main thing to note is that all these corruptions make the mistake of making antinatalism a global phenomenon that exists to serve their arrogant dreams of the future. In reality, the function of antinatalism is to ease the soul of the person practicing it by relieving them of the responsibility of that future. It removes partially your involvement in the short-sighted self-perpetuating misery of the species.
Economic crisis? World hunger? Trash culture with no principles? Not your problem anymore. All that's left now is resilience and you've won against a cycle that's been doing nothing but creating losers for many millennia.
There are several corruptions of the functional neutral antinatalism.
The most common is the environmentalist angle, they care only because they believe less people may shape an environment more comfortable for themselves within their lifetime. Then less common is those that do it out of hate, they simply want some form of retaliation against life but lack the violence in their heart to do more than yell at others to not have kids. Lastly, though adjacent to the environmentalists, there is the utilitarians that believe they can achieve some perfect society through selective culling. The main thing to note is that all these corruptions make the mistake of making antinatalism a global phenomenon that exists to serve their arrogant dreams of the future. In reality, the function of antinatalism is to ease the soul of the person practicing it by relieving them of the responsibility of that future. It removes partially your involvement in the short-sighted self-perpetuating misery of the species.
Economic crisis? World hunger? Trash culture with no principles? Not your problem anymore. All that's left now is resilience and you've won against a cycle that's been doing nothing but creating losers for many millennia.
I'm not antinatalist I just think only genetically superior people should breed and anyone else should fade away.
>>279296
How genetically superior. What standard do we use to measure this genetic superiority?
How genetically superior. What standard do we use to measure this genetic superiority?
>>279251
NDEs are just vivid hallucinations brought on by DMT which releases from the brain when death happens. Death is a process and not an instantaneous thing which before a certain point can be reversed.
NDEs are just vivid hallucinations brought on by DMT which releases from the brain when death happens. Death is a process and not an instantaneous thing which before a certain point can be reversed.
>>279331
I heard it's more like K-holing than DMT, but I haven't had a NDE so I can't confirm any way.
I heard it's more like K-holing than DMT, but I haven't had a NDE so I can't confirm any way.
If you don't want to have children, that's fine, if you don't want others to have the right to have children and you want to limit or prohibit this, well, then if I am in favor of fewer people in the world, then I would recommend to all these people that Grab your favorite rifle, point it at your head and pull the trigger.
Also for all the people who are in favor of abortion, if you think that killing an innocent child to make life easier for the parasitic father, and the mother, then you should shoot yourself since promoting the murder of innocent beings is not right.
You can justify that I also encourage murder with my publications, and it is true, but the murder of scourges, parasites that only want to take away the most basic right of individuals free from all evil in the world.
Also for all the people who are in favor of abortion, if you think that killing an innocent child to make life easier for the parasitic father, and the mother, then you should shoot yourself since promoting the murder of innocent beings is not right.
You can justify that I also encourage murder with my publications, and it is true, but the murder of scourges, parasites that only want to take away the most basic right of individuals free from all evil in the world.
>>279408
anti-natalism =/= pro-mortalism
you are an illiterate third worlder who can barely speak english, i suggest you polish your language skills and understanding of these concepts you're attempting to discuss before participating
anti-natalism =/= pro-mortalism
you are an illiterate third worlder who can barely speak english, i suggest you polish your language skills and understanding of these concepts you're attempting to discuss before participating
Of course I am an antinatalist. I've seen this philosophy brought up many times here in past years. Wizards usually get it.
>>279426
Parents think they can control way more about their kids' development than they actually can. Even best-intentioned, best-positioned parents spawn suicides, murderers, sufferers, and unfortunate mutants. Abstention from reproduction is an easy way to avoid creating new traumas. Human existence is such a burdensome gladiatorial shitshow where the only way out is through the mystery box of fatal pain and it shouldn't be forced on anyone.
Parents think they can control way more about their kids' development than they actually can. Even best-intentioned, best-positioned parents spawn suicides, murderers, sufferers, and unfortunate mutants. Abstention from reproduction is an easy way to avoid creating new traumas. Human existence is such a burdensome gladiatorial shitshow where the only way out is through the mystery box of fatal pain and it shouldn't be forced on anyone.
File: 1688913691662.jpg (125.82 KB, 1200x1068, 100:89, FoYJQ2MWAAACcqW.jpg) ImgOps iqdb
>>279429
I knew you'd give another generic "The kid might experience hardship at some point in her life" reasoning behind being against kids being born at all, to which I would have followed up with another question, but then you added
>Human existence is such a burdensome gladiatorial shitshow
And it confirmed that you're just another person who was ruined by some mysterious online institution in to being "blackpilled". You're a nihilist, you hate life and everything about it, so now you go in to any and all conversations about life and make a fool of yourself by proclaiming that life is painful. But why? Why spread this mindset? Who are you helping? Not yourself, obviously, because all you get is prudes like me calling your outlook shit. You're not helping other guys either, because anyone who bothered to read and consider your posts seriously would come out emotionally damaged like you. Your petty nihilism is like a street drug. You push it on young vulnerable people, they get hooked, and they wind up feeling like trash for a long while. You're a peddler of pain, a harvester of sorrow. You're a faggot.
>and it shouldn't be forced on anyone.
You're free to see yourself out of life at any time. And most people know this, and yet they endure because they enjoy life for what it is. And their children will too, at least, until they get mixed up with some nutcase such as yourself who tricks them in to hating life entirely.
I knew you'd give another generic "The kid might experience hardship at some point in her life" reasoning behind being against kids being born at all, to which I would have followed up with another question, but then you added
>Human existence is such a burdensome gladiatorial shitshow
And it confirmed that you're just another person who was ruined by some mysterious online institution in to being "blackpilled". You're a nihilist, you hate life and everything about it, so now you go in to any and all conversations about life and make a fool of yourself by proclaiming that life is painful. But why? Why spread this mindset? Who are you helping? Not yourself, obviously, because all you get is prudes like me calling your outlook shit. You're not helping other guys either, because anyone who bothered to read and consider your posts seriously would come out emotionally damaged like you. Your petty nihilism is like a street drug. You push it on young vulnerable people, they get hooked, and they wind up feeling like trash for a long while. You're a peddler of pain, a harvester of sorrow. You're a faggot.
>and it shouldn't be forced on anyone.
You're free to see yourself out of life at any time. And most people know this, and yet they endure because they enjoy life for what it is. And their children will too, at least, until they get mixed up with some nutcase such as yourself who tricks them in to hating life entirely.
>>279430
Ah, right. A moral nihilist. Someone who believes there is no right or wrong actions. That seems a perfectly apt description for someone who just explained their moral view that it is immoral to give birth.
Make it make sense.
Ah, right. A moral nihilist. Someone who believes there is no right or wrong actions. That seems a perfectly apt description for someone who just explained their moral view that it is immoral to give birth.
Make it make sense.
>>279430
you're crying about anti-natalism on an imageboard dedicated to celibacy to a degree which can be interpreted as an attempt to convince posters into reproducing
you should bother reading the rules of the website, if you're even capable of doing so, before you get yourself banned, stop shitting up the thread your overly emotional underaged faggotry
you're crying about anti-natalism on an imageboard dedicated to celibacy to a degree which can be interpreted as an attempt to convince posters into reproducing
you should bother reading the rules of the website, if you're even capable of doing so, before you get yourself banned, stop shitting up the thread your overly emotional underaged faggotry
a virgin can't be against anti-natalism, without violating the Kantian categorical imperative, that if you do it, everyone else should do it
It's crazy how opponents of antinatalism can get so defensive and insecure about antinatalism.
I guess I just don't understand "the point" of antinatalism. I mean most philosophy is inherently pointless anyway, but like is there an end goal? Do you guys want omnicide? Or just everyone to be sterilized? Just humans or all life?
>>279482
You don't get the point at all. It's not about brainwashing people into not having kids. It's to bring awareness to the fact giving birth is irreversible, selfish and even inmoral. Of course we can't stop people from breeding, but we can make them think twice about the consequences of bringing sentient life into this Hell.
You don't get the point at all. It's not about brainwashing people into not having kids. It's to bring awareness to the fact giving birth is irreversible, selfish and even inmoral. Of course we can't stop people from breeding, but we can make them think twice about the consequences of bringing sentient life into this Hell.
>>279483
If they want to have kids though they clearly must not think life is a hellish punishment though?
If they want to have kids though they clearly must not think life is a hellish punishment though?
I feel like AN is a "bug" of the mind. The whole reason pain exists is to discourage behavior that could harm you. If you feel pain your body tells you to take care of the issue ASAP and not strain that part of your body more. That's why people who are unable to feel pain end up disfigured. But life has not been made by an intelligent designer so sometimes pain is a problem as so you can end up in situations where you feel pain even if your life is not threatened like in the case of chronic pain or pain can be a hindrance to improving health like during surgery. Suffering is pain that you can't deal with quickly. The "bug" is seeing this imperfect mechanism that is there to protect us as reason to not exist.
But strictly speaking nothing has to exist and in the end it's all about what the majority thinks. If somehow the majority thought that pain was unbearable and AN was the way to go so would be it. I don't think there is an objectively true philosophy that people will follow just because of how convincing the truth is. You could make the perfect argument for AN and what use is it if only some intellectuals agree but the masses don't?
But strictly speaking nothing has to exist and in the end it's all about what the majority thinks. If somehow the majority thought that pain was unbearable and AN was the way to go so would be it. I don't think there is an objectively true philosophy that people will follow just because of how convincing the truth is. You could make the perfect argument for AN and what use is it if only some intellectuals agree but the masses don't?
>>279500
I don't think there was a designer at all, I think the universe and all of the suffering, pain, misfortune, beauty and life is all a coincidence, it simply happens and theres nothing we can do about it but push on.
I don't think there was a designer at all, I think the universe and all of the suffering, pain, misfortune, beauty and life is all a coincidence, it simply happens and theres nothing we can do about it but push on.
>>279510
your worshipping the void. be careful you don't lose your soul, if you haven't already. suicide usually comes after that
your worshipping the void. be careful you don't lose your soul, if you haven't already. suicide usually comes after that
File: 1689086804472.jpg (10.8 KB, 480x360, 4:3, hqdefault.jpg) ImgOps iqdb
I just have a hard time coming to terms with the duality of happiness and suffering in life.
I am immensely grateful to be born in these times. I love how years of technological progress, prosperity and time has allowed us to explore life in such depth. You have people for example not just cooking food with salt over a fire for nourishment but create a 10 course meal where every single ingredient has been cooked to perfection after years of experience. I love how people obsess over the smallest ingredients. I love discovering youtube channels that focus on just 1 topic that most people don't even think about.
Living in a 1st world country I am just amazed at how organized and polished things are. Like cars for example are not just tools to go for A to B anymore but have fun designs where every single component went through a rigorous design process. Same for architecture, furniture, clothes… I just blows my mind when I really think about it. It's quite overwhelming.
But then at the same time in the city I can see hobos cowered in shit and beggars with missing limbs. I made the mistake of going through a subreddit that popped up on the front page that collected horrible news and that made me sick.
As a depressed NEET I don't feel great most of the time and sometimes my body hurts so bad that in that moment I am unable to enjoy art anymore and am just reduced to trying to pass the time waiting for the pain to stop.
All the pleasure you feel gets instantly forgotten once you feel pain. You could be born to a rich family, with good looks, enjoying a ski trip where you are staying at a 5 star hotel and eating delicious food and then while skiing you fall badly and end up wheelchair bound unable to move and with chronic pain. Even if you had 40 years of a fun carefree life that's all gone then. I think pleasure and pain just can't be weighted. I can't say that all the progress I enjoy is worth the suffering others feel.
I am immensely grateful to be born in these times. I love how years of technological progress, prosperity and time has allowed us to explore life in such depth. You have people for example not just cooking food with salt over a fire for nourishment but create a 10 course meal where every single ingredient has been cooked to perfection after years of experience. I love how people obsess over the smallest ingredients. I love discovering youtube channels that focus on just 1 topic that most people don't even think about.
Living in a 1st world country I am just amazed at how organized and polished things are. Like cars for example are not just tools to go for A to B anymore but have fun designs where every single component went through a rigorous design process. Same for architecture, furniture, clothes… I just blows my mind when I really think about it. It's quite overwhelming.
But then at the same time in the city I can see hobos cowered in shit and beggars with missing limbs. I made the mistake of going through a subreddit that popped up on the front page that collected horrible news and that made me sick.
As a depressed NEET I don't feel great most of the time and sometimes my body hurts so bad that in that moment I am unable to enjoy art anymore and am just reduced to trying to pass the time waiting for the pain to stop.
All the pleasure you feel gets instantly forgotten once you feel pain. You could be born to a rich family, with good looks, enjoying a ski trip where you are staying at a 5 star hotel and eating delicious food and then while skiing you fall badly and end up wheelchair bound unable to move and with chronic pain. Even if you had 40 years of a fun carefree life that's all gone then. I think pleasure and pain just can't be weighted. I can't say that all the progress I enjoy is worth the suffering others feel.
>>279482
>I guess
>I mean
>but like
express yourself without sounding like a gen Z social media faggot if you wish to be taken seriously
>I guess
>I mean
>but like
express yourself without sounding like a gen Z social media faggot if you wish to be taken seriously
I get perturbed by the fact that lifeforms are just dressed up tooth-tubes cannibalizing each other and if we go without for long enough we potentially go feral. Our perception of life is glamorized by instinctual illusions but utterly disgusting and horrible if viewed objectively. We should not be able to view it objectively but our human minds are mutated and sometimes expand in directions where the ability for abstraction and empathy becomes overwrought, overriding the nonsensical sentimentality of the hindbrain. Then one sees that it is all a disgusting existence burden not to be perpetuated. The future belongs to the stupid
>>279535
>kill yourself
>gen z
>thinks wizchan isn't social media
>won't use proper punctuation
>sage
Express yourself without sounding like a jaded 4chan pedophile if you want to be taken seriously.
>kill yourself
>gen z
>thinks wizchan isn't social media
>won't use proper punctuation
>sage
Express yourself without sounding like a jaded 4chan pedophile if you want to be taken seriously.
File: 1689100524076.jpg (69.2 KB, 380x380, 1:1, 1688774532881291.jpg) ImgOps iqdb
>>279430
Which is morally nihilistic?
>Its always wrong to impose life onto a nonconsenting being?
Vs
>Suffering is le good! Wubbalubbadubdub!
Which is morally nihilistic?
>Its always wrong to impose life onto a nonconsenting being?
Vs
>Suffering is le good! Wubbalubbadubdub!
File: 1689100696853.jpg (62.5 KB, 700x700, 1:1, 1686558077035927.jpg) ImgOps iqdb
>>279191
Speak for yourself. I live in celibate and live a wizardly life but I worship life and am thankful to be born. Antinatalism is nothing but sheer demonic navelgazing and everyone promiting it should be ashamed of themselves.
It's always bitter chronically online internet people so full of themselves that spew this kind of crap, people that actually went through horrible catastrophies and lived to see another day, people that actually have some merit in proposing such thoughts, basically never do. If anything, what I hear from them is an almost unanimous gratitude.
I have been bullied for practically my entire life and had countless of my hopes and dreams shattered time and time again and have wished for my own death sometimes. But it's not like I got the Black Death. It's not like I went through a Soviet death camp.
We have it so fucking good compared to 99% of every person that has ever lived before us, and the lack of gratitude I sometimes see expressed towards the marvels of modern science, healthcare, societal boons etc etc is just so fucking appaling.
Speak for yourself. I live in celibate and live a wizardly life but I worship life and am thankful to be born. Antinatalism is nothing but sheer demonic navelgazing and everyone promiting it should be ashamed of themselves.
It's always bitter chronically online internet people so full of themselves that spew this kind of crap, people that actually went through horrible catastrophies and lived to see another day, people that actually have some merit in proposing such thoughts, basically never do. If anything, what I hear from them is an almost unanimous gratitude.
I have been bullied for practically my entire life and had countless of my hopes and dreams shattered time and time again and have wished for my own death sometimes. But it's not like I got the Black Death. It's not like I went through a Soviet death camp.
We have it so fucking good compared to 99% of every person that has ever lived before us, and the lack of gratitude I sometimes see expressed towards the marvels of modern science, healthcare, societal boons etc etc is just so fucking appaling.
>>279565
>n-no you :'((!!!
Lol. Yeah, you don't care until your mom finds you as a pile of nasty red feted jelly, slumped over your keyboard.
>n-no you :'((!!!
Lol. Yeah, you don't care until your mom finds you as a pile of nasty red feted jelly, slumped over your keyboard.
Also I misspelled it because I'm trying to become a pile of fetid rotten jelly slumped over my keyboard
File: 1689122695496.gif (329.32 KB, 1520x1200, 19:15, animal path summons.gif) ImgOps iqdb
>>279569
No.
No.
>>279569
Yes, you seem so morally superior to everybody ITT. You seem like the type to suffer mightily, and not curse himself. Lol you are fooling nobody, lord have mercy.
Yes, you seem so morally superior to everybody ITT. You seem like the type to suffer mightily, and not curse himself. Lol you are fooling nobody, lord have mercy.
>>279571
It is interesting how the life lovers invariably reveal themselves to be vile or immature
It is interesting how the life lovers invariably reveal themselves to be vile or immature
File: 1689125367464.jpg (39.06 KB, 720x720, 1:1, 1637361893144.jpg) ImgOps iqdb
>>279574
peepee poopoo
peepee poopoo
Dangerous amount of 1 line posts for what is a serious topic. What is going on? This is not a fast board, you can put some more thought into your posts.
>>279593
why must i suffer when we are in a empty void of fucking nowhere? why is it hard to find peace with this realization?
why must i suffer when we are in a empty void of fucking nowhere? why is it hard to find peace with this realization?
>>279573
I'm not sure, but I'd guess the guy who was talking to me is in actuality feverishly miserable, and has taken this sanctimonious attitude as some kind of defense mechanism against his own true outlook of his life. I don't really care. I just know it's a technique I've used before, and sometimes still fall into. See how fragile it is?
I'm not sure, but I'd guess the guy who was talking to me is in actuality feverishly miserable, and has taken this sanctimonious attitude as some kind of defense mechanism against his own true outlook of his life. I don't really care. I just know it's a technique I've used before, and sometimes still fall into. See how fragile it is?
Were any wizards around for that weird "anti-natalist" section of youtube in the 2010s, with people like inmendham, somethingsea, derivedenergy??
>>279755
I do remember people here posting some deranged looking guy with long blonde hair here.
I do remember people here posting some deranged looking guy with long blonde hair here.
>>279760
Yeah,that's most likely Inmendham. I like to watch his draftscience videos. They are good for a laugh if you like totally bullshit science made up by the mentally insane. Its like the flipside of flat earth retardation. He is so butthurt by the implications the indeterminacy principle has on his antireligious worldview, he tries to prove people like Einstein and Schroedinger are morons and posits that quantum phenomena are just continuations of newtonian physics. I would have much rather posted the "Einstein was an Idiot" video he made but I suppose he got too much hate and couldn't trannyjanny all the comments so he just took it down completely.
Yeah,that's most likely Inmendham. I like to watch his draftscience videos. They are good for a laugh if you like totally bullshit science made up by the mentally insane. Its like the flipside of flat earth retardation. He is so butthurt by the implications the indeterminacy principle has on his antireligious worldview, he tries to prove people like Einstein and Schroedinger are morons and posits that quantum phenomena are just continuations of newtonian physics. I would have much rather posted the "Einstein was an Idiot" video he made but I suppose he got too much hate and couldn't trannyjanny all the comments so he just took it down completely.
>>279817
I think he fancies himself Zapffe's last messiah but would be loathe to admit it. He has a strange little cult built up around him.
I think he fancies himself Zapffe's last messiah but would be loathe to admit it. He has a strange little cult built up around him.
[Last 50 Posts]