/jp/ - Japan/Anime

You forgot the most important measure:

-Promote loli as much as possible

It's bonafide norm repellent.

>>36816
Yeah, fanservice in general is a good measure too.

>>36817
normalfags love fan service though, easy to digest anime titty physics and pantsu shots are the peak normalfag, not suited to any wizard of high taste

>Is not neccesary to have all these things, but at least one
Couldn't disagree harder. Being candidate for all of the listed categories should be considered the most basic of basics. Otherwise, under this metric, some 14 year old retard could say he's a hardcore anime fan for simply being really really into MHA, and only MHA, or any other shounentrash like Tokyo Revengers. It should be obvious why someone who only watches a single genre, or god forbid only a single anime, should not even remotely be considered an anime fan.

The only metric I personally hold is whether or not someone realizes that all of anime, every single genre and convention, holds value and purpose in and of itself, as it's all interconnected. Not to say they absolutely must watch or even like/love all of them, but the complete and thorough shedding of inherent western dog bias against wide swathes of the medium should well be considered the first true precept. Most never even make it this far, not even this board, and that's truly pathetic.

>>36818
Because as we all know, 30 year old virgins and fanservice-addled, pantsu-flashing moe anime are never, have never been, and will never be associated with each other.

>>36816
If someone does not like loli at all they are a normalfag. I knew this man online who would check the age of all the characters even if they looked old enough because he was afraid of being a "pedophile".Normalfags cannot enjoy loli because they are afraid of what society would think.

>>36822
Don't project yourself, neither your insecurity nor your incapacity to gatekeep, to others.
Also, most probably you don't fit any of the listed criteria in the OP. So your opinion is not relevant neither.

>>36819
I said it depends. How much he knows about said anime? He knows really everything? Because calling the name of few characters and some fights is knowing next to nothing. I'm talking here about truly being an erudite in that specific anime. Though is truth like even them, probably is not feir to consider someone like that an anime fan yet. What you said is a more genuine form of knowing is someone is anime fan, but one with very high power level. When you're more inexpert you can be into anime, not know all genres very well just for pure ignorance. Yet, is a good measure of the legitime power level, anything below that means that the person still needs to learn some things. But is speacially useful to gatekeep tryhards and cut their influence in people.

>>36825
>I'm talking here about truly being an erudite in that specific anime. Though is truth like even them, probably is not feir to consider someone like that an anime fan yet.
That's why it's part of the most basics of basics. To get to that point is not indicative of any wider perspective on anime as a whole (or if it is, it's probably negative.) Anyone can get hyper specifically into a singular work, but that doesn't necessarily make them a fan of the medium. It's like if I were to get heavily into a singular western movie in a specific genre, knowing literally everything to know about it, but vehemently despising or turning my nose up at everything else Hollywood. Nobody in their right mind would claim that makes me a hollywood fan, but anime does not share in this for magical reasons.
However, this at least shows a level of focused commitment that is still necessary and important, as it's indicative of the dedication and autism necessary to transition yourself into being a true fan.

>What you said is a more genuine form of knowing is someone is anime fan
yes
>but one with very high power level
Not necessarily. It's all about the attitudes involved of the watcher. Though it's fairly typical of new-age retards to only stay in their chosen genre while screeching about all others despite never watching them (or only giving the most singularly perfunctory viewing before everlasting judgment), the reverse is also true, with fresh off the boat people with no bias or expectations trying everything out with a clear mind and making their own opinions. That doesn't necessarily make them high power level though, since this mindset is achievable from the very getgo. The distinction is only that the former, if he ever deigns to give stuff outside of his direct clear interests a shot, will inevitably whine about the most infantile and stupidest shit, like "moe" artstyle or CGDCT not having a "plot" or sexualization, any number of inane zoomer babble, and then go right back to their corner. The latter likely won't, even if they similarly decide they don't like any of those aspects as well. One way precludes the mere possibility of any objective worth for the vast majority of anime and the other doesn't. If you're in the former camp, dismissively eliminating massive chunks of the medium arbitrarily, then absolutely no matter what you are not a fan in any measure, even if you've watched hundreds of your particular shows.

>-Knowing in deep a lot about an anime, visual novel, light novel, novel, manga or game in particular.
I like this line of thinking, but instead of being 'a' specific anime, VN, LN, etc etc, over the course of a fans journey to the startline, it should be at least one (preferably more) examples from all of them. They all fall under the umbrella of the anime industry and any real fan has dabbled in them all.

Personally speaking I'd like to see:
- Never skipping OP/ED
- Always listening to insert singles, character songs, image songs, OSTs, and so on
- Seiyuu appreciation
but I'm well aware that's asking too much and elitism territory. Except the OP/ED thing I won't budge on that if you skip them honestly just kill yourself.

>>36822
It has been a long time since I last saw that image

>>36826
Very well made post. I want to give a proper reply now but honestly is (too) late and I need some sleep. Don't want to speak gibberish. With some sleep can make a better reply tomorrow.

You don't gatekeep anime. What you do get to gatekeep, kinda, is the anime community you're a part of, so my tip for that is not having threads like this that are meta and have absolutely no bar of entry whatsoever for posting. Having threads that are not about a specific title or artist is the foundation for every shit thread on this board. So yeah imo OP should be kept out the gate on this one. Let's see just how effective that is. this thread is likely to reach 200+ posts you just watch

I don't want to just scold OP on this so I'll amuse him with one thing that really bars casuals out and that is knowing Japanese and posting about content that has no translation out there, so you know everybody responding is invested enough. Having access to the media without the need of a middleman explaining to you what you're watching/reading, that's what it is. I've been reading a bunch of LN that don't have translations out there for the past year or so and decided to post about one recently, guess how many responses I got from that? I gatekept so hard everybody here was out but me, but that's usually what happens once you're past a certain point.

>>36829
Don't give up! Even if you've filtered yourself by being pointlessly elitist, maybe there's more interested people than you think if you just do your best and speak with passion about your niche interests

>>36826
I mentioned the abundant knowledge in a particular work, being quite fond of it to the point of knowing all its points, from bottom to top. Although this obviously varies it usually indicates a broad knowledge, which then extends to the author, and derivative works such as adaptations (or aversion to these, as we not infrequently see happen among true fans of something, who tend to look at their adaptations with disgust for good reason. Though fortunately, this is not always the case, of course). As you rightly mentioned, it's an important requirement because it demonstrates the right level of autism you need to have to then become a fan of the medium in general. But it is true that it is not necessarily going to give way to this, it is the case of the deviations from the good path you mention, of people who cling to a single genre or even worse, a single work, while despising the rest of genres or the medium itself. Some are just indifferent, which can be harmless. But the ideal is to have at least some respect for the rest of the genres, which does not imply that someone necessarily likes all of them, but can understand them. It is also true that there are other requirements that can be given and that could be good indicators for someone to enter the medium, being this other one that appreciates different genres, even if the person is not necessarily into it.

However, you may have noticed that in more recent times the first requirement is increasingly rare. Although for our luck anime is nowadays in a quite healthy state (and I would say that interesting times are coming), strangely still this doesn't coincide with the fandoms, there are less and less knowledgeable people of the first type we are talking about here. While of the second, I would say that there is a good amount, which is not bad. But in a good fandom there should be both types of fans, and it seems to me that the first one is getting scarce. And that's why I've mentioned it here as a special requirement for gatekeeping.

By the way, someone who whines about these sort of inane things you mentioned, is being gatekeeped. Deservedly.

I think you set the bar too low, simply with OP/ED appreciation. The truth is that the medium has perfected the art of making openings and endings more than any other. That someone appreciates them is the least you can ask for. The bar should be set higher for these. That it's not just a superfluous valuation of the music. But a genuine appreciation of the combination of the music with the animation and the conection it with the series. The same applies to soundtracks.

>>36835
>I think you set the bar too low, simply with OP/ED appreciation.
You would seriously think so, but the amount of people who skip them on the regular is incredible. Despite the average viewer not watching much at all, they still feel the need to save those precious 3 minutes after giving them a watch once, or maybe twice.

>However, you may have noticed that in more recent times the first requirement is increasingly rare
I'm not so sure of this. If anything, I'd say it's actually becoming slightly more prevalent. In the past, circa 2005 or before, anime was stringently gatekept by the companies bringing them over. If you wanted to watch something, you took what you got on broadcast television or perhaps borrowed/rented VHS/DVD. Fortunately, they tended to bring over a decent spread of genres overall, so nascent anime fans would get a fairly widespread education and be far more accepting of further "weird" anime. With the rise of streaming and simulcast Crunchy bullshit, kids are given an infinite and ever changing variety menu with little to no guide and no reason to select anything but the most familiar, which tends to be dumb shounenshit or narou isekai since they are dumb children after all.
Considering this, I find they tend to fit neatly into that first category of people. They know just about everything there is to know about shounen of all sorts. They're still worthless to talk to despite their technical knowledge though, because that's the only thing they watch and care about. To say they're biased is a ludicrous understatement, not to mention how hostile they are to even the mention of anything else.

>By the way, someone who whines about these sort of inane things you mentioned, is being gatekeeped. Deservedly.
For sure, but what happens when those types begin to considerably outnumber and outpurchase actual fans? KnY is/was a minor phenomena, and JJK's manga sales rose almost 600% because of the anime, which also sold well. Even past shows like SAO or that shitty Slime one sell consistently. Meanwhile, otaku-oriented things of all sorts still subsist on 3k BD sales, if they even reach that. The industry will always follow the money and that's incredibly worrying right now with this terrible idea of global outreach.

>>36824
Baboon thinks typing out "projection" makes his posts coherent, no one has the heart the tell him the truth. Lacking any rational thought, he makes plans to gatekeep something flooded over with normalfags already, maybe his plan is to keep the normalfags in and everyone else out?

>>36827
You mean the image itself or my edit?

I find that knowing the names of at least three or four notable animators, as well as having a mild appreciation for sakuga/sakuga history is a significant step in the right direction. Directors and writers tend to get top billing, and thus they enjoy more visibility; it takes a special brand of autism to hunt down the work of this or that gengaman and rifle through back issues of Animestyle looking for obscure interviews with your favorite creators.

>>36836
But things like SAO already have several barriers that make those who watch it adapt correctly to the medium. It has its dash of fanservice and moe, while maintaining a central plot that must be paid attention to with themes that sometimes change from volume to volume. Other series you mention are not the typical, which is not a bad sign at least for the more "mainstream" side of the medium.

Obviously like autist that we are, is not our 'field', but is mostly harmless to us. Ours is the 'rare' field (don't mistake the work itself being rare, with it being known by little people, these two things are not necessarily always together). But you probably have that feeling because there has been a certain scarcity of rare things. Though the really otaku stuff and its audience is still there, things like zombie idol are doing pretty well for example. But I think that we're in a transition period that is coming close to an end, in which I think much weirder works will start to appear, and in part because the influence of the medium itself is reaching everywhere and influencing many artists. When that moment come, gatekeeping is going to become sky-high.

Don't really need a list just keep track of the main red flags.

Does the person legitamatly enjoy the thing as it is or are they trying come in and take control of something because it isn't the way they think it should be based on some outside agenda that has nothing to do with the quality or artistic value of the work.

For example
Some passionately complaining about autistic details of a show differing from the source material or the action sequence lacking impact is standard otaku shit and they belong.

Someone passionately complaining about representation or how offensive something like the fat succubus being a joke character is problematic is poser invader SJW shit and they need to be ran out ASAP.

I’ve seen like this too many times so I gotta ask, how the fuck do you intend one gatekeeping anyone from something they can freely access of their own volition. It’s like when people try to gatekeep imageboards, when literally anyone with an internet access can use them to the same extent as any veteran. So please explain how defining any of this will some how push away the undesirables.

>>36876
The same way any community gatekeeps. Make it unstated policy to treat undesireables like the garbage they are, and eventually they either become not-garbage, or they go away. Besides, this place is so small you could hardly call it a community so it's not like there's going to be anything coming from all this. There's no harm in talk though, so whatever.

I think its really hard to gate keep anime/manga nowadays because there are people (including big names) that actively try to market it to as many normies as possible, and actively fight against gate keeping

I agree

Just enjoy what you enjoy and let others enjoy what they enjoy. Suggesting measures for gatekeeping is retarded. Someone who's actually into anime shouldn't learn about specifics of the medium solely for the purpose of gatekeeping.

>>36829
the only thing youre gatekeeping is yourself, if you know japanese you can go elsewhere and discuss it in japanese

>>36815
The ultimate Gatekeeping anime

raise your anchors wizards, two anti-piracy conglomerates just loco-roco'd in to one big force. Funimation and Crunchfail are the hellgates from which normalfags find anime to ruin, and they have teamed up.

>>37532
Arrr…

The barrier to entry for a hobby that consists only of sitting and staring at a screen is very low. I'm beginning to feel like anime is a hobby for teenagers and young adults regardless. I'm no longer the target demographic.

>>37585
sitting and staring at a screen is hard for some people

>>37532
Whatever, no skin off my balls. Only means I can torrent whatever few new anime series that's actually watchable an hour after it aired on Japanese television. Meanwhile fansubbers focus all of their attention on obscure anime laserdiscs they find off of Japanese auctions and tsunami disaster site scrap heaps

Set sail for one piece.. download

>>36815
>Being very invested at least in one fandom.
Drop this normalfaggotry.
I just enjoy anime by myself and am never able to talk about them to other people because whatever they write isn't interesting

>>36815
You are a normalfag. You consume mass media and get upset when others consume the same media. You are the exact poster child of a consumer who's identity is built around what they consume rather than any personal achievements or family status. You can't gatekeep a commercial product and you have no power over who watches or owns it.
>>36816
Fuck off pedos. You're hated every where you go and you always will be.
>>36819
Would you consider someone watching all of DBZ, Pokemon or Naruto not to be a hardcore fan? Bit different to watching just Kill la kill.
>>36822
But these are the elite weebs. They're going to post CP and scare normalfags away from their anime interest.. As if the most consumed media in the world isn't anime.
>>36927
This has always been the case of anime. No one creates things for no one else to interact with. The bigger the market the better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIaW4JPvP5A
>>37630
Fandoms is a succubus's term. OP is a roastie.

>>37631
You act like 90% of anime are good little consumer whores that buy all of their anime, and totally don't just torrent the ENG translations online as soon as they come out. I see you bumped all the recent threads with angry posts, I'm honestly curious what type of anime/Japanese culture you appreciate.

>>37633
Most people do get anime legit now. They aren’t buying BDs or anything, but shit like Netflix and god forbid Crunchyroll are “easy” ways for all the normalfags to get anime, and to them it’s easier than torrenting or finding streaming sites.

As an aside, dubs are becoming more popular too because of this.

>>37634
The only disadvantage to this is Japs trying to appeal more to the American market with 3D animated films and cancerous societal values.

>>37636
I didnt read the entire thread. I thought it was about how the new generation of kids are growing attached to the dozen insanely popular shonen series and that's somehow a bad thing

Dragonball, Yu Yu Hakusho, Saint Seiya, Bleach, Naruto …. now it's time for Boku no Hero Academia & Kimetsu no Yaiba.

who cares if some retarded niggers watch an anime
just talk about it on a non-normalfag board and you'll actually get discussion

>>36818
>>36820
5D gatekeeping

>>37710
skip that shit just watch mother fucking jujutsu kaisen

>>37631
look who watches shounen

>>37990
I watch shounen sports. Fight me!

>>36816
Haha. Nope.

>>36873
I agree completely only you need to ditch the "SJW" label, it's an empty dodge term, these people don't care about justice, they're hateful feminists and when they pretend to care about race or diversity they're intersectional feminists.

>>38292
I will use whatever the fuck terms I want.

>>38083
Not an argument.

>>36815
It's a lost cause, disney is going to make the next big anime and they're going to hire animators from china and korea but the main writer and art director is going to be some troon or twitter feminist

>>36815
How do you gatekeep something that's already had it's gates broken, at the very minimum, a decade ago?

>gatekeeping anime
lol you can't and even if you tried you've already failed

here is what you do
ignore everyone else
find anime by looking through CURRENT SEASON AIRING and just add stuff to your list
watch it and finish it
repeat when you want to watch more anime
if CURRENT SEASON is exhausted, watch older stuff
never at any point do you need to interact with other people regarding anime online
it's a fucking tv show aired in another country for foreign children primarily
get over yourselves and just enjoy it by yourself and ignore everything else

This is the most retarded thread I've seen in a while.

Like how do you even think you can enforce such a gatekeeping? You're going to write a letter to the Japan's prime minister to ask for such measures? The UN? The WHO.

How fucking idiotic you can be that you think you can force people to stop doing things you don't want? Specially when the entry barrier is so absurdly low.

Gatekeeping only works when you have the means to enforce it, that's why you don't have access to luxury cars ,yachts and golf clubs, yet you somehow think you can forbid people from downloading and consuming things on their homes.

>>40577
>>40580
>>40581
Why did you bump a dead thread you stupid fucking zoomers?

>>40582
>zoomer
>oomer
back to 4chan.

>>40580
>not having rss feed to instantly download every new anime that comes out and insta play it the moment it's finished
i bet you're one of those casuals who only watch 2-3 shows per season

>>40584
speculate all u want im a closed door for anime youll never know what i know

>>40581
The problem is that this type of media became too separated from it's fans. An "anime fan" can be someone who watched 5 series or 500 and you can't tell the difference unlike in other media like books/games/movies.

>>40586
>you can't tell the difference
you can. noobs are always easily spot on

>>40592
Not anymore. There's way too many resources available. A basic Google search of anime name + MAL description + YouTuber giving his opinion takes less than 5 minutes to digest and is enough to convince any anime watching tard.

>>40592
I guess you weren't on the "End of the Wizard" threads. It's a simple task to become an expert with wikis, youtube tutorials and the internet in general.

>>40595
That pretty much happened to me in experience as well. Zoomers just mass-consume binge a bunch of content that is already pre-selected by the fanbase without having to develop their own tastes for what's good or not. They don't even think about what they watched because it's just a consumption thing for them, so when they see you criticize it all they can say in return is "you just don't like anime bro"

>>40593
>>40595
>>40599
ok, i guess that my isolation from this kind of folks has led me to wrong assumptions about them. anyway why care unless you're 4shit /a/ user? i don't know any more or less active zoomer-less anime forums because i don't give enough fuck about anime anymore to bother seeking them, but sure they exist, right? say me i'm right, please. because when i was relatively active in anime imageboards were satisfactory now they're dead

>>40593
>There's way too many resources available.
Someone can do all of that and still be easily identificable as someone who didn't read or watch the original material. People who only have second or third hand account of a work are as easily identificable as people who have no knowledge at all.

>>40599
>Muh zoomer boogeyman
Oh drop it already wouldn't you.

>>40602
>Oh drop it already wouldn't you.
The whole anime movement has just been reduced to zoomers mass solo binging anime on Netflix or Crunchy nowadays. This is why it's impossible to get any sort of discussion going. If you try to discuss anime with zoomers at best you will get one posting fan art back at you or something, at worst you'll get something like "bruh this doo cares about anime too much"

>>40602
>in denial
Maybe you can IRL where they can't quickly google something but IRL you'll also be competing against their social status. So you can point them out for the frauds they are but they'll be buoyed by their social status and their peers will defend them.

If all you're going for is self-satisfaction then there's no point in engaging with any community.

>>40611
You're talking about normie zoomers. Look outside the bubble to pick up with more interesting zoomers.

>>40612
>IRL
You can do it anywhere and is very easy. If you can't recognize when someone is pretending to have read/watch something maybe is because you haven't read/watched it yourself, anon. Hopefully you're not doing that.

>>40613
>Still in denial and attacks me
>ignores the second part
The internet still hosts the actual anime episodes themselves you know. They can still watch certain episodes and use wikis and youtuber recaps to shape their opinions.

Regardless you can call them out and they won't flinch.

I mean like do you really think anime can be gatekept when they've knocked down the gates and claimed ownership?

>>40614
They can say whatever they want one they're exposed as liars there's no more reason to take them seriously.

>>36816
I know this post is like 2 years old but not even gatekeeping with loli works anymore. Just look at the dancing loli meme that normalfags are obsessed with and have been posting all over TikTok. Even fucking corporations are using it for their marketing like pic related.

Unfortunately, gatekeeping anime isn't exactly possible on account of what anime is: a medium whose foundation starts and ends with 'watching' :an activity, if you'd like to call it that, with such incredible accessibility that anyone of any age or education can easily get into it, sparing no effort beyond paying attention to qualify themselves as people in a cohort who're now 'fans'.

There is, however, one way around this, as is the case in every sincere effort to gate-keep and that is through complexity, convolution; an intellectual bar such that those unable to grasp and reach onto it for a length of time, invariably skip out, throwing it off because of incomprehensibility, even come external assistance; videos, walk-throughs, guides, you name it.

Lolis don't do the trick.
Rape doesn't do it
Underage copulation doesn't do it.
Incest doesn't do it.
Gore/Guro doesn't do it.
GangBangs don't do it.
Futas don't do the trick: on the contrary, people like it these days, for some reason.
-These can't cut it because, in as much as they may leave a bad taste in someone's mouth, it's just that - a bad taste, digested properly with a driving impetus of 'it's just a stupid fictitious thing, I can carry on' and, so they do, killing off one thing after another.
Here's your takeaway: what should've kept normal people away, isn't, on account of it being mere 'fiction'; abhorrence, yes, but it's fiction, pixelated nonsense all the same.

However, you can't say the same for matters convoluted, matters that require you to use your head to make sense of things.
What should have been a story, a mere time killer, a relaxing game, suddenly is not: you find yourself, upon engagement, unable to elicit the base reaction into which your brain can then comfortably initiate engagement of sorts from which any satisfaction ensues.
The anime you're watching or the game you're playing, is suddenly morphing to an experience not unlike your Pure Math exam in that nothing makes sense, an hour has passed and, you've completed only 3 of the 20 questions, 20 minutes remaining.
Now, you're discouraged from further pursuit. Why bother doing any other question? not like It'll matter, I'm getting a failing grade anyway: analogously, why continue playing this game or watching this anime? I should be relaxing right now! I'm meant to be having fun! where's the fucking fun in manipulating 'spreadsheets' and crunching numbers for 800 turns to beat one fucking boss, then do the same fucking thing for 50 others!?
'Why would I bother watching 80 minute episodes of characters bantering about the explications on the myth of Descartes?'
-Once your interest has all its myriad complaints centered around complaints like this, know that what you're engaged in is what I'll call a filtering-machine: it kills the refuse whose presence would, in the end, contribute nothing, neither in discussion nor in elucidation. The sort of people who can do little more than parrot 'memes', post a picture or four, make an asinine comment, you know them.

Really, what's going on here is that the aforementioned rendition of stomach churning instances to 'fiction-stomached' cannot occur because their selection of interest is, this time, insisting, foremost, of a feature exclusive to you, in the real world, exactly -once again- as something like Pure Math would or, let's use another example, programming. Not the slapstick copy this and copy that but actual programming.
And so it goes that you can't disengage, put low or discard that which is self-evidently before you: your intellectual ability and its limits.

Here's a diagram to help you visualize what I'm thinking of, provided it doesn't make much sense.

Any how, going back to point and to conclude: if the brass tacks of some thing aren't deeply rooted in otherwise complicated factors to ordinary people, then the thing in question can never be gatekept for gate-keeping is an activity unto itself, forever prone to failure if left at the hands of anything otherwise.
This is why JOP content & literature -novels qualify but never manga. Never ever- will retain their sanctity forever

>>41219
Messed up the image: here's the properly viewable version.
https://files.catbox.moe/090k3c.PNG

>>41220
tldr; enemy is normalfag, there's no salvation, if you want a safe haven with high resistance towards the enemy make it arbitrarily complicated

>>41219
Some of the most popular anime both in the West and the East fit what would be your kept anime, such as GitS, Evangelion, Lain and the Patlabor movies. I even believe that much of what ruined anime communities in the West was the leaning towards "meaningful", "intellectual" or "mature" anime, since people could join without being "losers", or at least being the cool losers. Any doubt will be resolved by a few youtube video essays that will arbitrarily set a standard for any requirement of thought, explanation, or reference to be understood. In the end Sazae-san, Chibi Maruko-chan, Ninja Hattori-kun, etc, are much safer, and even old shounen that didn't become particularly popular in the West will do. I think the "Japanese only" may be the closest to actually keeping people out.

>>41223
Pretty much.
>>41224
Thank you for the response.
The issue with arbitrary standards -and with them, arbitrary conclusions- is problematic but only provided the subject of interest is initially allowing them to be so: this means that the work in question was never really intellectual and that any interpretation of it being as, is accomplished thanks to a number of guises or references woven here and there to create a pretty convincing illusion.
So, in short, if the anime in question can allow for a possibility of an interpretation besides what the man behind it truly intends, then it was never worth considering in any titling of 'filtering machines': naturally, proceeding with this, nothing you've listed qualifies: A meaningful message, a discernible -but not so easily done- theme, a continuous motif –all of these, even when put together as they were in Evangelion, do not necessarily result in qualification.
If all it takes is a Youtuber pinning down every reference and connecting dots to curate an explanation, then, the work is not at all intellectual. No. It can't possibly be, provided the connotation I'm associating intellectual with: not accessible.

Most people, even in a literal dumbed down step by step guide into a Navier-Stokes equation, won't ever develop a means to wrap their heads around it.
Someone can go through the most careful, one to one explanation, giving an abstract of an abstract of an abstract, condensing all that matters into a few equations, shed some historical context and still, it wouldn't make sense
Here, this does the job pretty well: https://www.claymath.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/navierstokes.pdf but about nearly everyone would just ignore it entirely. That's what you need: something that inherently rouses the urge to ignore and this is only producible through complication.

Look at the other anime you've listed:
https://myanimelist.net/anime/951/Chibi_Maruko-chan
https://myanimelist.net/anime/2406/Sazae-san

See the problem? They have reviews. Yes, reviews -things structured only by a people who're never truly attached to their subject of interest because what matters to you, truly, is never broadcasted, never intended to be shared, never spread, never put into words. Its magic is retained in such a way that you and you alone are privy to it hence why it's magical at all.
Secondly, that people can read and interpret the reviews at all is a problem. Once a god forsaken review is made, it remains standing there, urging one to engage with what's reviewed which, in turn, means urging the possibility in which a normal person can come across it and then, by some whim, choose to engage it.

A properly complicated anime is inverse in its proportion to getting a review whether because the effort to do so isn't worth it, because a complicated matter selects naturally for a people willing to invest in it -and, all people who do never make reviews for the reason listed above- or because it's just meaningless.
After all, all complicated anime are unpopular, they must surely be considering everything I've just said.
So, once again, it is, that neither the party of 'let's call ourselves different with this', the 'loners', those wanting to be mature and even the contrarians latch onto it because any merit in doing so is utterly void due to evoking no reaction whatsoever.
'I was busy fucking around those hard questions on leetcode.com yesterday night'
-No one will care.

Summarily:
[1] An anime is only rightfully allowed a prerogative to call itself complicated when it can't be understood even provided accessibility to all its references
[2] Similarly, an anime is only intellectual when no arbitrary interpretation is applicable given an explicit genesis, by the author, as to what the story is about
[3] If it has reviews, it's not complicated.
[4] If [3] is somehow miraculously contradicted, say a review in a backwater forum by a 70 year old fan, then its contents must be non-perusable to anyone
other than people of his ilk and should be interpreted as nonsensical jargon in every other instance
[5] If ordinary people can watch it for longer than a few seconds, it is not complicated.
[6] If it is translated, the likelihood of it being 'complicated' is extremely poor.
[7] If it is popular, it is not complicated.
[8] In the end, if it's understandable, it's not complicated.


I will once again stress that nothing you've listed is either a mature, 'deep, 'intellectual' or head scratching anime.
It never was and never will be.

>>41225
It seems you are creating a circular argument:
>it has to be complicated to keep normies out
>if normies are in the reason is that it's not complicated
The term "complicated" is inherently requiring "absence of normies".

Outside of anime, do you think the fact that there are videos on youtube explaining in detail tool assisted speedruns, and also that some of them have millions of views, mean it's not something complicated enough?

Unless I musunderstood and what you really mean something to the sense of "the only place free of normalfags is in your personal perception of the object".

>>41226
The whole normies bullshit will always be circular because it's a boogeyman that doesn't exist.